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CLOSED CAPTIONING PROVIDED BY BEAVER COUNTY.
UM, THIS IS THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION AND TODAY'S WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 1ST, 2021.
UM, BILL DARBY, COULD YOU, UH, CALL THE ROLL CALL PLEASE? YES, SIR.
WHEN I CALL YOUR NAME, PLEASE STAY HERE.
HAS IT LANE GALLAGHER ADAMS PRESENT BRUCE TRIMMER, JESSE SOLOMON PRESIDENT THERE EACH SMELTER.
JOSH, DID WE HEAR MICHAEL WENT BACK HERE.
SO WE DO HAVE JOSH AND HE JUST UNDERSTANDING IS HE HAS THE, STILL THE ABILITY TO VOTE AND LISTEN AND CONTRIBUTE JUST AS IF HE WAS THERE.
SO I JUST WANTED TO KIND OF CLARIFY THAT SINCE THIS IS A HYBRID THING.
SO, UM, WILL YOU BE FLIPPING HIM IN AND OUT WHEN HE WANTS TO, OH, THERE YOU, THERE YOU, ARE YOU GOING TO BE A LITTLE, JUST SO YOU KNOW, HE, HE, HE CAN, HE CAN SEE EVERYTHING HE CAN SEE UPFRONT AS YOU CAN SEE ON HERE.
SO HE IS WATCHING HE'S, UH, CAN UNDERSTAND EVERYTHING AND HEAR IT.
AND WHEN WE DO GO TO THE PRES PRESENTATION MODE, HE WILL BE ABLE TO SEE THE PRESENTATION AS YOU SEE IT.
A NOTICE REGARDING A GERMAN, THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION WILL NOT HEAR A NEW ITEMS AFTER 9:30 PM UNLESS AUTHORIZED BY A MAJORITY VOTE OF THE COMMISSION MEMBERS, PRESENT ITEMS WHICH NOT HAVE BEEN HEARD BY NINE 30 MAY BE CONTINUED TO THE NEXT REGULAR MEETING OR SPECIAL MEETING DATE, AS DETERMINED BY THE COMMISSION MEMBERS NOTICE REGARDING PUBLIC COMMENTS, EVERY MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC WHO IS RECOGNIZED TO SPEAK, SHE'LL ADDRESS THE CHAIRMAN.
AND IN SPEAKING, AVOID DISRESPECT TO THE COMMISSION STAFF OR OTHER MEMBERS OF THE MEETING, STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS.
WHEN SPEAKING FOR THE RECORD, COMMENTS ARE LIMITED TO THREE MINUTES, UM, AND IT LOOKS LIKE I HAVE, UH, ONE COMMENT SHEET OR DO WE HAVE ANY ADDITIONALS I'VE NOT RECEIVED ANY OTHER PUBLIC COMMENTS? SO, UH, JUST AS, AS, AS FAMILY MEMBERS, UM, YOU DON'T NEED TO SIGN UP FOR THE PUBLIC COMMENT.
SO DURING THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK, UM, DURING THE, THE PROJECT, YOU'LL BE ABLE TO SPEAK WITH THE APPLICANT AND AS THE PROPERTY OWNER.
SO YOU WILL NOT BE LIMITED TO THE ACTUAL THREE MINUTES.
THANK YOU FOR THAT CLARIFICATION.
SO THEREFORE WE HAVE SOMEONE ELSE FILLING OUT A PUBLIC COMMON CARD, SO WE'LL HAVE TWO PUBLIC COMMENTS AND THEN THEY'RE GOING TO BE A PART OF A, ANOTHER THAT YES, SIR.
AND I'D RECOMMEND THAT, UM, WHEN WE GET TO THAT, WHATEVER THE ITEM IT IS, IF, IF BELIEVE IT'S THE NINE BRUIN, UH, THAT WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO DO THE, UH, STAFF PRESENTATION QUESTIONS, HAVE THE APPLICANT PRESENT AND THEN HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO BE ABLE TO SPEAK AT THAT POINT.
THANK YOU FOR THAT CLARIFICATION, UH, ADOPTION OF THE AGENDA AS WRITTEN, UH, AND I GET EMOTION REGARDS TO THE AGENDA.
I'LL MAKE A MOTION, UM, TO ADOPT THE AGENDA AS WRITTEN SECOND, THAT MOTION.
ARE THERE ANY, UH, COMMENTS, DISCUSSIONS, IF NOT, UH, VOTE ON THE AGENDA? UM, ALL IN FAVOR.
UH, GENDER IS ADOPTED ADOPTION OF MINUTES AS WRITTEN FROM AUGUST 4TH, 2021 FOR THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION MEETING.
DO I HAVE A MOTION FOR THE ADOPTION OF MINUTES TO ADOPT THE MINUTES? THANK YOU.
ANY DISCUSSIONS REGARDING THAT? IF NOT, CAN I GET A VOTE ALL IN FAVOR? AYE.
BRITAIN ARE ADOPTED AND UH, LET'S SEE.
THEN WE HAVE A, THERE'S NO PUBLIC COMMENTS THAT ARE NOT ON THE AGENDA.
IS THAT CORRECT? EVERYTHING THAT COMMENTS THAT WE HAVE ARE FOR THE AGENDA ITEMS? CORRECT.
UM, OLD BUSINESS AND 80 ARE, IT LOOKS LIKE YOU'RE UP FOR, IF WE GOT APPROPRIATENESS FOR THE BEARD FAMILY, IS THAT CORRECT?
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NOW THIS ONE, JUST FYI.THIS IS THE ONE THAT WE HAD PRESENTED TO US.
AND NOW IF YOU LOOKED AT SOME OF THE MINUTES, UH, IF YOU LOOKED AT THE MINUTES FROM PREVIOUS AND THEN LOOKING AT THE APPLICANT IS THIS, THIS IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT FROM WHAT WE'RE USED TO SEEING.
I THINK IT'S KIND OF CLEAR, BUT IT'S JUST A LITTLE DIFFERENT, I BELIEVE.
WASN'T IT ISN'T THAT WE'RE REVISITING A PROJECT WE ALREADY SAW.
HOPEFULLY IT'D BE ABLE TO GET THIS SO THAT HE CAN SEE IT AS WELL AS YOU ALL I'LL DO IT LIKE THIS TONIGHT.
UM, SO THIS IS AN APPLICATION FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, AS YOU MENTIONED, IT IS ONE THAT IS OLD BUSINESS.
SO WE HEARD THIS LAST MONTH, THE APPLICANT HAD COME BACK TO US WITH A LITTLE BIT OF ADDITIONAL INFORMATION, UM, AND A FEW REVISIONS SO THAT THEY WERE CLOSER TO BEING IN LINE WITH THE STANDARDS FOUND IN THE UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT ORDINANCE.
IT IS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO ALLOW THE CONSTRUCTION OF A NEW TWO-STORY SINGLE FAMILY, RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE OF APPROXIMATELY 2,369 SQUARE FEET AND A CARRIAGE HOUSE OF APPROXIMATELY 624 SQUARE FEET LOCATED AT 16 ROBERTSON, WHICH IS IN THE OLD TOWN, BLUFFTON HISTORIC DISTRICT END ZONE NEIGHBORHOOD GENERAL.
SO YOU CAN SEE THIS IS BRIDGE STREET THAT RUNS ACROSS THE BOTTOM OF THE PAGE.
I COULD MAYBE MAKE THIS BIGGER.
GOSH, CAN YOU STILL SEE IT? THUMBS UP WORKS.
UM, SO THIS IS THE LOCATION MAP.
YOU CAN SEE BRIDGE STREET ALONG THE BOTTOM.
HERE'S WHARF STREET IS THE SMALL SIDE STREET HERE THAT GOES UP TOWARDS, UM, HIGHWAY 46.
AND IT IS THE THIRD LOT IN, FROM WARF STREET.
SO YOU CAN SEE IT HIGHLIGHTED IN BLUE, TINY ON THE SCREEN THERE.
UM, AND JUST FOR THE RECORD, MIKE LOVECCHIO HAS JOINED US AT A 6:05 PM.
YOU CAN SEE IT IS SURROUNDED ON ALL FOUR SIDES BY THAT SAME ZONING DISTRICT.
SO IT IS NEIGHBORHOOD GENERAL ALL AROUND AND THEN THE EXISTING CONDITIONS.
AS OF THE LAST MEETING, I DID NOT TAKE A NEW PICTURE FROM THIS WEEK, SO THE GRASS MAY BE AN INCH TALLER.
HERE IS THE, UM, LOT AGAIN, THERE ARE TWO LOTS HERE.
SO YOU SEE THE FIRST LOT IS WHERE THE, UM, IS THE ONE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT TONIGHT.
IT IS BETWEEN THE YELLOW HOUSE AND THE CENTER OF THESE TWO HOUSES, I GUESS.
UM, AND THEN THE SECOND LOT IS JUST OFF THE SCREEN.
SO YOU DON'T SEE ANY OF THE FRONTAGE OF THE SECOND LOT, BUT YOU DO SEE SOME OF THE BACK OF THE LOT HERE.
SO, UM, YOU CAN KIND OF SEE THERE'S A BLUE.IN THE MIDDLE OF THE SCREEN WHERE I DREW WHERE THAT STEAK WAS, THAT SPLITS THE TWO PROPERTIES.
SO THE SHARED ACCESS IS NO LONGER SHOWN ON HERE.
UM, THIS IS SOMETHING THAT IF THE, UM, PROPERTY OWNER DOES NOT SHOW IT, THE TOWN OF BLUFFTON DOES NOT HAVE TO, UM, ADDRESS THE EASEMENT.
HOWEVER, IF ANOTHER SURVEY COMES IN FROM THE OTHER PROPERTY OWNER, THE TOWN DOES ACKNOWLEDGE THESE MEN, IF IT IS SHOWN ON THEIR SURVEY.
SO THIS IS THE SURVEY A LITTLE BIT CLOSER WITHOUT THE HEADER, BUT JUST SO THAT YOU CAN SEE THE SCREEN A BIT BETTER.
SO THIS CORNER HERE IS THAT YELLOW HOUSE THAT YOU WERE SEEING HERE IS THE FLOOR PLAN OR THE SITE PLAN.
SO YOU STILL HAVE THE CARRIAGE HOUSE AT THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY.
UM, THEY HAVE ADDED THE STEPS ON THE SIDE HERE AND REMOVED THE DOOR FROM THE SIDE, WHICH WAS ENCROACHING INTO THAT SETBACK AND ONTO THE NEIGHBORING PROPERTY.
UM, ALONG WITH THE STAIRS HAVE BEEN, UM, SHORTENED SOME IN THE FRONT TO BE ALL WITHIN THE PROPERTY HERE, I'VE TURNED IT SIDEWAYS.
SO THAT ROBERTSON IS ON THE RIGHT SIDE BECAUSE IT WORKS BETTER ON THE SCREEN THIS WAY.
UM, I HAVE KEPT ROBERTSON ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE SCREEN FOR EVERY TIME THAT I FLIPPED THE, THE APP OR THE, UM, IMAGE.
SO THAT IT'S A LITTLE BIT LARGER.
SO HERE'S YOUR FIRST FOUR PAN.
IT LOOKS VERY SIMILAR TO WHAT YOU SAW LAST MONTH.
THERE WAS A DOOR HERE, HOWEVER IT HAS BEEN REMOVED.
THIS IS THE SECOND FLOOR I'VE GOT THE SWITCH.
AND THEN THIS IS YOUR SECOND FLOOR HERE.
UM, SO YOU CAN SEE THAT THERE'S NO LONGER THE STOOP DOWN UNDERNEATH HERE, BUT YOU DO STILL HAVE THE ROOF LINE AS WELL AS THE FULL LENGTH, THE FULL SIDE PORCH THAT DOESN'T HAVE ANY ENCLOSED SPACE ON IT ON THE SECOND FLOOR.
SO YOU CAN SEE, AGAIN, THIS IS THAT SIDE PORCH.
HERE'S THE CHIMNEY ALONG WITH THE, THE ROOF THAT RUNS ALONG THE SIDE AND THE GARAGE PLANS.
I PUT THEM ALL IN ONE PAGE BECAUSE WE HAD VERY FEW COMMENTS ABOUT THE GARAGE.
SO YOU'VE GOT YOUR FIRST FLOOR, SECOND FLOOR AND REPLAN.
SHOULD ANYONE NEED IT? BUT SOME OF THESE ARE THINGS WE'VE BASICALLY ALREADY SEEN.
SO, UM, HERE'S THE FRONT ELEVATION.
THIS IS WHERE THINGS START TO CHANGE A BIT.
SO ON THE FRONT ELEVATION, THEY HAVE ADDED THESE DOORS HERE.
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LOUVERED DOUBLE COURTESY DOOR TO MATCH THE SHUTTERS.AND THEN THE SHUTTERS ARE HERE.
THEY DID PROVIDE A SHUTTER SAMPLE, WHICH WE WILL GET TO IN JUST A FEW MINUTES.
AND THEN THE STEPS ARE NO LONGER COMING OFF THE SIDE.
THIS IS THE LEFT ELEVATION, WHICH IS THE SIDE THAT FACES THE VACANT PROPERTY TO THE, TO THE LEFT.
UM, THAT ORIGINALLY HAD A DOOR SHOWN HERE WITH A SMALL STOOP.
IT'S NOW BEEN TURNED INTO A WINDOW THAT HAS THE SHUTTERS TO MATCH THE RIGHT ELEVATION.
SO THIS SPACES, THE YELLOW HOUSE AND THE DRIVEWAY.
UM, THIS HAS THE RAILINGS ADDED INTO THE SECOND STORY PORCH HERE, AND YOU'VE GOT THE RAILING NEXT TO THE STAIRS AS WAS REQUIRED.
AND THEN THIS IS THE REAR ELEVATION, WHICH LOOKS VERY SIMILAR TO THE FRONT ELEVATION.
UM, HOWEVER IT HAS THE DOOR THAT IS SET BACK ONTO THE PORCH RATHER THAN THE, UM, COURTESY DOOR THAT YOU SEE ON THE FRONT HERE ARE THE ELEVATIONS FOR THE CARRIAGE HOUSE.
SO THIS IS THE FRONT WHICH FACES ROBERTSON AND THE RIGHT SIDE, WHICH FACES YELLOW HOUSE.
THE REAR FACES THE WOODS AND THE LOT BEHIND IT AND THE LEFT FACES INTERNAL TO THE LOT.
AND THEN THE VACANT LOT BEYOND THAT.
AND THEN JUST FOR CONVENIENCE, I HAVE THE GARAGE SECTIONS, WHICH WE CAN GO BACK TO.
SHOULD YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ON THEM, AS WELL AS THE HOUSE SECTIONS AND WALL SECTIONS AND SOME DETAILS, INCLUDING THE, UM, RAILING DETAIL, WHICH WAS ASKED FOR, AND THE CORNER BOARD DETAIL, WHICH WAS ASKED FOR AT THE PREVIOUS VERSION, AND THEN THE SCREEN DETAIL, ANOTHER ITEM THAT WAS ASKED FOR IN THE PREVIOUS VERSION.
SO IN YOUR STAFF REPORTS THAT ARE IN THE PACKETS, AS WELL AS THE ONE THAT IS FOUND ON THE WEBSITE, I WENT THROUGH AND PUT A STRIKE THROUGH ON ALL OF THE ITEMS SO THAT THE NUMBERS WOULD STAY IN ORDER AS I MARKED THEM OFF.
SO THAT IF YOU HAD ANY QUESTIONS, WE COULD REFERENCE BACK TO THEM THAT WAY.
HOWEVER, IN THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION ON MY SLIDE SHOW HERE, I HAVE REMOVED ALL OF THOSE AND LEFT ONLY THE ONES THAT STILL NEED TO BE ADDRESSED OR STILL NEEDED A DETERMINATION FROM THE HPC.
UM, SO YOU'VE GOT YOUR RENDERINGS HERE.
YOU CAN SEE THE DOOR HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM THE SIDE, ELEVATION, THE STAIRS HAVE BEEN SHORTENED, THE CURTESY DOOR ADDED TO THE FRONT HERE AND THE SHUTTERS, AND THIS IS FROM THE OTHER SIDE.
SO AGAIN, THERE'S THE STEP SHORTENED, HERE'S THAT CARRIAGE HOUSE AT THE REAR OF THE LOT, UH, THE RAILINGS WERE SHOWN UP IN THE SCREEN PORCH.
AND THEN THIS IS FROM THE LEFT REAR OF THE STRUCTURE, WHICH WOULD BE STANDING ON THE BLUE DOT THAT WAS IN MY ORIGINAL PICTURE OR THE VACANT PARCEL LOOKING TOWARDS, UM, ROBERTSON AT THE FRONT AND YELLOW HOUSE IN THE BACKGROUND HERE IS THE LANDSCAPE PLAN.
UM, SO THEY HAVE CHANGED THE TREE LOCATION.
SO IT IS JUST INSIDE THAT SETBACK LINE AT BOTH THE FRONT AND THE REAR.
THERE IS STILL ONE TREE THAT IS LOCATED HERE.
UM, HOWEVER IT HAS THE STREET TREE HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM IT, AND THIS TREE HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM IT.
I'VE ZOOMED IN A BIT SO THAT YOU COULD SEE IT A LITTLE BIT CLOSER.
AND THEN I'VE ZOOMED IN ON THE PLANT SCHEDULE FOR CONVENIENCE.
AND THEN AS THIS IS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, UM, THE HPC CONSIDERS THE EIGHT REVIEW CRITERIA THAT ARE SET FORTH IN SECTION 3 18, 3 OF OUR UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT ORDINANCE AND HAVE THE AUTHORIZATION TO APPROVE THE APPLICATION IS SUBMITTED, APPROVE THE APPLICATION WITH CONDITIONS OR DENIED.
THE APPLICATION IS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT.
WE DO HAVE REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE APPLICANT HERE TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF THE PROJECT.
I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS, UM, AS WELL AS HOPEFULLY THE APPLICANT AS WELL.
SO IF YOU'D LIKE, I CAN GO THROUGH, SINCE WE'VE GOT LIMITED SEATING TONIGHT, I CAN GO THROUGH STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION AND THEN WE CAN OPEN UP THE FLOOR TO THE APPLICANT.
WHY DON'T WE DO THAT? AND THEN HAVE THE APPLICANT APPROACH.
THE FACT THAT WHERE IS THE APPLICANT I WAS GOING TO SAY, I SAW THEM COME IN.
UM, SO THE FIRST ONE IS THAT THE LANDSCAPE PLAN HAS BEEN REVISED, UM, SO THAT THE STREET TREE AND THE, THE STREET TREE AND THE TREE AT THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY HAVE BEEN REMOVED ON A LANDSCAPE PLAN.
IF YOU TAKE A LOOK HERE, IT IS STILL SHOWING, OH, IT GOT SMALL AS A SHARED ACCESS HERE.
SO IT IS STILL ABLE TO IS THAT, UM, THIS TREE IS THE ONLY ONE THAT COULD NOT COUNT TOWARDS THE CANOPY COVERAGE CALCULATION IF THAT WERE TO BE USED AS AN ACCESS.
UM, AND IT IS STILL LARGER, UM, IN DIAMETER THAN A POND WOULD TYPICALLY GROW.
SO HELP ME UNDERSTAND THIS AGAIN, WHY CAN'T THIS BE USED, UH, SINCE IT'S LOCATED IN WHAT IS LABELED ON THEIR LANDSCAPE PLAN IS A SHARED ACCESS.
IF IT IS COUNTING TOWARDS THEIR CANOPY COVERAGE AND IT BECOMES AN ACCESS POINT, THEN THAT TREE WOULD NEED TO BE TAKEN DOWN IN ORDER FOR THE ACCESS POINT TO BE USED.
SO, UM, IT'D BE SIMILAR TO PLANTING A TREE RIGHT HERE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE DRIVEWAY.
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IF THEY PLAN ON PROPELLING A CAR INTO THE LOT, IT WOULD BE A PROBLEM THERE, UM, ON THEIR SURVEY THEY'VE UPDATED IT.SO IT DOESN'T SHOW THAT THAT'S JUST FINE.
UM, AND IT IS OKAY, BUT IT IS SHOWING.
SO IF IT IS LOCATED IN THE SIDE ACCESS THAT IS ACCEPTABLE, HOWEVER, IT IS STILL BEING SHOWN AS A LARGER DIAMETER FOR THE CANOPY, THEN WOULD, IT'S ALMOST TWICE THE SIZE OF WHAT THIS TREE SPECIES GROWS TO BE.
UM, IT'S SHOWING IS ABOUT A 60 FOOT DIAMETER CANOPY AND, UH, ALPINE TYPICALLY GROWS NO LARGER THAN ABOUT 25 AND THAT'S WELL FERTILIZED AND WATERED.
THE SECOND ITEM IS THAT A DETERMINATION ON THE BUILDING TYPE MUST BE MADE.
WE DISCUSSED THIS AT THE LAST MEETING, HOWEVER, I'M A SIDE YARD HOUSE.
IT MEETS THE SETBACK REQUIREMENTS FOR SIDE YARD HOUSE AND THE SQUARE FOOTAGE.
HOWEVER, ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS OF A SIDE YARD HOUSE IS THAT IT HAS A FULL LENGTH SIDE PORCH ON THIS SPECIFIC BUILDING.
YOU CAN SEE THAT IT DOES HAVE A MAJORITY OF THE STRUCTURE WITH A SIDE PORCH.
UM, HOWEVER IT IS ABOUT, UM, 40% OF THE FIRST FLOOR AND 66 ISH PERCENT OF THE SECOND FLOOR THAT HAS THAT PORCH FROM THE FRONT.
UM, AND I BELIEVE THE HPC DISCUSSED THIS AND SAID THAT THEY FELT THAT THIS DID MEET THE INTENT OF THAT.
HOWEVER, A DETERMINATION WILL STILL NEED TO BE MADE ON THAT, WHETHER IT MEETS THE BUILDING TYPE BASED ON HOW IT IS PROPOSED.
UM, IF THE HPC FINDS THAT IT DOES NOT MEET THE CRITERIA FOR THE SIDE YARD BUILDING TYPE, THEN THE SIDE YARD WOULD NEED TO BE INCREASED FROM FIVE FEET TO 10 FEET FOR THAT STEP BACK, BECAUSE IT WOULD BE REVIEWED AS AN ADDITIONAL BUILDING TYPE.
SO, UM, NUMBER THREE IS DEPENDENT ON THE RESPONSE FOR NUMBER TWO HERE.
SO, UM, THE NEXT ITEM IS THAT THE MATERIAL FOR THE COLUMNS IS LISTED ON THE APPLICATION IS COMPOSITE.
IT IS LISTED AS WOOD ON THE, THE PLANTS SET, HOWEVER, THEY'RE JUST NOT LEADING UP.
SO THAT JUST NEEDS TO BE UPDATED.
UM, A WINDOW DETAIL SHOWING THE CONFIGURATION OF THE MUTTON PATTERN HAS NOT BEEN PROVIDED, SO THAT NEEDS TO BE PROVIDED.
AND, UM, THE WATER TABLE IS SHOWN AS A FIVE QUARTER STOCK FOR THE SKIRT BOARD.
THE DRIP BOARD IS I BELIEVE SHOWING UP AS A, TO, UM, UH, TO BUY MATERIALS ON SOME OF THE DETAILS, BUT IT'S NOT SHOWING UP ON THE ELEVATION.
SO IT'S LABELED IN A FEW PLACES AND IT JUST NEEDS TO BE CONSISTENTLY AT LEAST A FIVE QUARTER STOCK.
IT'S SHOWING UP AS A ONE BY, UM, AND I CAN FIND THAT IN JUST A MINUTE, IF YOU ALL WOULD LIKE TO SEE WHERE THAT IS.
I WILL HAVE TO TAKE A LOOK AT IT A LITTLE BIT CLOSER HERE, BUT IT'S SHOWING UP IN A COUPLE OF THE DETAILS AS WELL AS THE ELEVATION IS HAVING A ONE BY.
SO IT NEEDS TO BE, UH, UH, FIVE QUARTER MINIMUM.
UM, THE NEXT ITEM IS THAT THE SHUTTERS WOULD NEED TO BE REVISED TO A DURABLE WOOD MATERIAL OR ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ON THE COMPOSITE PROPOSED, UM, NEEDS TO BE PROVIDED TO ENSURE THAT THE SHUTTERS WILL BE CONSISTENT WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
AND THE MATERIALS USED ARE EQUAL OR BETTER QUALITY THAN TRADITIONAL BUILDING MATERIALS, FURTHER THE TRADITIONAL CONSTRUCTION PATTERN STATES THAT YOU SHOULD USE THE, UM, THE TOUCH ROLL.
SO IF IT IS AT A LEVEL THAT IS ABLE TO BE TOUCHED BY SOMEONE.
SO IF IT IS BELOW THE SECOND STORY, AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT CAN BE TOUCHED, IT WOULD NEED TO FEEL AS THOUGH IT WERE THE SAME AS THAT MATERIAL.
UM, THEY HAVE PROVIDED A SAMPLE WHICH IS SITTING BEHIND MR. CHAIRMAN.
YOU'VE GOT THE, YOU HAVE THE VANNA WHITE TONIGHT.
UM, SO HERE'S THE MATERIAL THAT YOU GUYS CAN PASS A LITTLE BIT TO FEEL IT.
UM, STAFF HAS FOUND THAT THE PRIMARY PORTION OF IT DOES FEEL AS THOUGH IT IS A WOOD MATERIAL, HOWEVER, IT'S GOT METAL END CAPS TO IT.
UM, AND THE LOUVERS ARE VERY, VERY LIGHT.
SO, UM, TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION AS YOU REVIEW THIS ONE, NUMBER EIGHT IS A COMMENT THAT IS ADDITIONAL TO WHAT WAS IN THE ORIGINAL STAFF REPORT, BECAUSE WITH THE ADDITION OF THE, UH, COURTESY DOOR ON THE FRONT ELEVATION, IT IS GOING, IT IS PROPOSED AS THE SAME MATERIAL AS THE SHUTTERS.
SO THE FRONT DOOR WOULD ALSO BE MADE OF THIS MATERIAL AS PROPOSED, BUT A DETERMINATION ON THE APPROPRIATENESS OF THE MATERIAL USED FOR THE PRIMARY DOOR MUST ALSO BE MADE.
AND THEN NUMBER NINE IS, UM, IS JUST A NOTE THAT THE SERVICE YARD LOCATION IS SHOWN ONLY ON THE CARRIAGE HOUSE.
UM, WE DISCUSSED THIS AT THE LAST MEETING, BUT BECAUSE IT'S NOT TYPICAL, NO SERVICE ITEMS WOULD BE ABLE TO BE LOCATED AT THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE.
THEY WOULD ALL NEED TO BE FED FROM THAT SERVICE YARD UNDER
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THE STAIRS OF THE CARRIAGE HOUSE.AND THAT IS WHAT IS LEFT FROM THE CONDITIONS THAT WE HAD AT THE LAST ONE, PLUS THE LAST TWO, WHICH, UM, HAVE BEEN UPDATED BASED ON THE, THE NEW SUBMITTAL.
I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS, BUT I THINK WE COULD ALSO OPEN IT UP TO THE APPLICANT IF THAT IS ALL RIGHT WITH YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN, YES.
WOULD THE APPLICANT LIKE TO ADD, OR, UH, DISCUSS ANY OF THESE PLEASE? AND IF YOU COULD JUST STATE YOUR NAME? YES, OF COURSE.
UM, WE'VE GOT ASHLEY HERE WITH ME AS WELL.
UM, KATIE, THANK YOU FOR PLAYING.
WHAT'S THAT? WHAT ROLE ARE YOU PLAYING? I AM THE ARCHITECT.
SO, UH, THANK YOU, KATIE, FOR THAT THOROUGH REVIEW OF, OF WHAT WE'VE PROPOSED HERE.
UM, YOU KNOW, WE'VE KIND OF KEPT PRETTY SIMPLE.
IT WOULD JUST GOING WITH A SIMPLE CHARLESTON STYLE SIDE PORCH HOUSE, AND THERE ARE A LOT, SO THIS IS JUST KIND OF THE NATURAL SOLUTION FOR, FOR WHAT WE WERE GIVEN.
UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S JUST ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'VE KIND OF APPROACHED THIS AS GOING THROUGH THE REVIEW PROCESS, TRYING TO ADDRESS COMMENTS AS BEST AS POSSIBLE, BUT ALSO, YOU KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, WHAT THE SHUTTER IS TRYING TO PROVIDE A, A MORE DURABLE SOLUTION FOR THEM FOR LONG-TERM, UM, I GUESS LESS THAN MAINTENANCE LONG-TERM WISE, JUST TO KEEP, KEEP, UM, KEEP THE HOUSE LOOKING, LOOKING BEAUTIFUL FOR YEARS TO COME, WITHOUT HAVING TO WORRY ABOUT UPKEEP AND THIS THE SAME WAY WITH A LOT OF THE OTHER MATERIALS AS WELL, BUT I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS, UM, RESPOND TO THESE POINTS AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE AND, UH, KIND OF GO FROM THERE.
AND I'M GOING TO REFER BACK TO OUR DISCUSSION THAT WE HAVE THE ORIGINAL ONE IN REGARDS TO SIDE PORCH.
I THINK THAT EDIT DOES REFLECT THE, BE A SIDE PORCH, JUST LIKE WE DONE HISTORICALLY.
UH, YOU CAN FIND A LOT OF EXAMPLES OF BUILDINGS WITH A PARTIAL SIDE PORCH, MOSTLY AS A RESULT OF THE FACT THAT THE BUILDINGS WERE EXPANDED OVER THE YEARS AND THEY JUST DIDN'T EXPAND THE SIDE PORCH TOO.
IT LOOKS PERFECTLY IN PROPORTION TO WHAT IS WHAT THE INTENT OF THE EDO IS AND WHAT A SIDE PORCH.
AND TO ELABORATE ON THAT, WE SWITCHED SOME MATERIALS FOR THAT SAME KIND OF METHOD OF INFILL PORCH.
SO THEN THE VERTICAL SIDING WAS AN ATTEMPT TO KIND OF REITERATE THAT FACT IN SOME WAY SERVICE YARD.
I THINK WE DISCUSSED THAT IN THE LAST ONE TOO, IS YOU WERE MENTIONING THAT IT WAS GOING TO BE LOCATED AT THE GARAGE, WHICH IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT, BUT IT'S GOING TO BE FEEDING THE WHOLE HOUSE, AIR CONDITIONING AND BRIARS AND THE WHOLE SCHMEAR HAVE, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE MISHMASH OF STUFF HANGING ON THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE.
JUST FROM THE SIZE OF THE LOT, WE FELT IT WAS EFFICIENT ENOUGH JUST TO KEEP EVERYTHING CENTRALLY LOCATED AND THAT, YOU KNOW, NEXT TO THE GARAGE KIND OF TUCKED AWAY FROM THE HOUSE.
SO YOU DON'T HAVE ANY NOISE POLLUTION THAT'S COMING FROM THOSE UNITS, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT INTERRUPTING BEDROOM SPACES.
SO THAT WAS JUST KIND OF THE PHILOSOPHY BEHIND IT.
DO YOU WANT TO REFER TO THAT? YEAH, I MEAN, I WAS JUST GOING TO, NOT TO, UH, I WAS TRYING TO LOOK AT THE PLAN IN A WAY, UH, OBVIOUSLY YOU'LL HAVE A TIGHT, UH, SITE WHERE YOU COULD MEET THE REQUIREMENTS.
I'M NOT TRYING TO, UH, LIKE OVER SUGGEST SOMETHING.
BUT ONE THING I WAS SEEING IN THE SITE PLAN BEFORE WAS THE LOOKS LIKE THAT DRIVEWAY, UH CHAMFERED OR HAD A FILET RIGHT THERE AT THE GARAGE, UH, THAT MIGHT BE AN OPPORTUNITY TO PICK UP, UH, UM, SOME CANOPY TREE.
LIKE IF WE FLIP BACK, I THINK TO THE SITE PLAN, IT LOOKS LIKE, UH, I DON'T KNOW.
I WAS JUST TRYING TO, UM, IT'S A TOUGH THING WITH THE, UH, WITH THAT EASEMENT, RIGHT.
UH, CAUSE YOU'RE VERY LIMITED AS, YOU KNOW, EVERY DRIVEWAY IN YOUR HOUSE ON WHERE YOU CAN PUT TREES THAT MEET YOUR CANOPY.
UM, BUT THAT COULD BE A POTENTIAL OPTION IF THAT SITE PLAN IS YES, THEY'RE RIGHT THERE.
UM, EITHER ONE OF THOSE, IT LOOKS LIKE ON THIS ONE WHERE YOU'RE COMING IN ON THAT, UM, ON YOUR GARAGE AREA, THAT MIGHT BE A POTENTIAL, I KNOW IT'S GETTING TIGHT, UM, OR EVEN ANYWHERE ALONG THE SIDE AND I ONLY HAVE FIVE FEET, BUT I'M JUST TRYING TO COME UP WITH A WAY.
THAT'S REALLY THE ONLY OTHER LOCATION THAT YOU COULD PUT, UH, SOMETHING THAT WOULD GIVE YOU CANOPY COVERAGE.
I THINK WE'RE, WE'RE DEFINITELY OPEN TO SUGGESTIONS FOR OPPORTUNITIES TO INCREASE THAT DEFINITELY WORKING TOWARDS THAT.
UM, AND WITH THE EASEMENT, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY WITH THE LANDSCAPING PACKAGE, IT WAS SOMETHING THAT, UM, I DON'T BELIEVE THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT WAS ABLE TO UPDATE THE, UM, I GUESS THE BASE LAYER FOR THAT.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, IF IT'S, IF IT'S A MATTER OF TAKING THAT INFORMATION OFF OF THE LANDSCAPE, SO IT DOESN'T READ AS THERE'S AN EASEMENT THERE, I THINK FOR CLARITY SAKE, WE'RE MORE THAN HAPPY TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN.
I MEAN, I THINK FROM THE TOWN'S PERSPECTIVE, THEY'RE JUST SAYING THEY CAN'T COUNT IT.
AND, UM, WHAT'S HAVE BIG ENOUGH THOUGH.
WHAT'S THAT IT'S NOT GOING TO GROW
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BIG ENOUGH THOUGH.IT'S A YO PAWN AND YOUR POEMS DON'T GET THAT BIG.
I MEAN, THERE WAS TWO COMMENTS, BUT THE MAIN ONE, UNLESS I'M INCORRECT IS THE TOWN'S CONCERNED THAT AT ANY, AT ANY POINT THIS COULD BE AN ACCESS HE'S MET AND THEN THEY WOULD NO LONGER MEET A REQUIREMENT.
THE REST OF THE PLANTING CAN GO AWAY AND IT STILL WOULD BE FINE AS FAR AS THE UTO.
UM, I WAS JUST TRYING TO, WE HAVE APPROVED, UM, PLANS IN BUS.
I WAS JUST WITHOUT, UM, SOMETIMES WITHOUT THAT MUCH OF A LANDSCAPE PLAN, I WAS JUST TRYING TO SEE IF IT WAS IN FACT FEASIBLE.
UM, CAN IT BE COVERAGE? AND I MEAN, IF YOU WERE OPEN TO THAT, IT LOOKS LIKE THERE IS AN OPPORTUNITY BY YOUR GARAGE TO PUT SOME THINGS.
UM, I THINK ADDING THE, THE PLANT THERE, THE TREE, THERE IS SOMETHING THAT WE'RE WELCOME TO DO, YOU KNOW, IT'S, I THINK THE MORE, THE MORE, THE BETTER IN MY OPINION, AS LONG AS IT'S NOT KIND OF OVERWHELMING THE LOT, AND I THINK THAT'S A GOOD LOCATION FOR SOMETHING TO SEND, TO BE PLANTED THERE, THE CHAIRMAN, UM, I TH I THINK MY MIC IS ON.
SO IF IT'S NOT, I APOLOGIZE, IT MAY BE THAT THEY ARE MEETING THE 75% REQUIREMENT WITHOUT THE CANOPY COVERAGE FROM THAT TREE, BECAUSE THAT CANOPY IS SHOWING IT ABOUT TWICE THE SIZE OF WHAT IT IS.
UM, BUT A MAJORITY OF THE CANOPY FROM THAT YELLOW PAWN IS OVERLAPPING EITHER CANOPY FROM THE LIVE OAK AT THE FRONT OF THE LOT OR THE ROOF.
THERE'S REALLY ONLY GOING TO BE ABOUT MAYBE 60 SQUARE FEET OF, AND THAT'S A GENEROUS COUNT OF WHAT THAT TREE WOULD COUNT FOR.
SO IT'S POSSIBLE THAT THEY CAN LEAVE THAT TREE THERE, BUT IT JUST, IT WON'T COUNT TOWARDS THE CANOPY, BUT THAT MAY NOT BE AN ISSUE YOU'LL JUST NEED TO, DOUBLE-CHECK HAVE THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT, DO THE CALCULATIONS ON IT AGAIN.
I MEAN, I'M, I'M FINE WITH THAT.
UH, IF APPLICANT CAN MEET THAT REQUIREMENT FINE WITH THAT BEING DONE AT A STAFF, ANY, UH, JOSH, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD? I KNOW YOU'RE ON MUTE.
NO, I THINK, UM, I THINK THEY'VE WORKED HARD TO SATISFY THE REQUEST AND, YOU KNOW, THE, I THINK THE ONLY ITEM AS IT RELATES TO THE SHUTTERS, AND I HAD MENTIONED EARLIER, THE QUALITY OF THIS MATERIAL, THE QUALITY OF THE SHUTTER THAT, UM, THAT I AM FAMILIAR WITH THAT I THINK IT PROBABLY EXCEEDS, UM, THE EXPECTATIONS AS A COMPOSITE MATERIAL.
IT IT'S MADE IN SUCH A MANNER TO, TO MAINTAIN THE ITS CHARACTER AND ITS, ITS AUTHENTICITY FOR AN EXTENDED PERIOD OF TIME.
SO I DON'T HAVE ANY OBJECTION TO THE USE OF THAT COMPOSITE SHUTTER.
IN THIS INSTANCE, I DO HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT THE SHUTTERS.
UM, THEY ARE PVC COMPOSITE, AND I REALLY DON'T THINK WE SHOULD BE SETTING PRECEDENT FOR PLASTIC COMPOSITES AND IT'S HEAVY.
IT'S GOT THAT NICE STEEL EDGE.
AND THERE ARE A LOT OF OTHER PARTS OF BUILDINGS THAT COME IN PVC COMPOSITE THAT I DON'T THINK WE WANT TO SEE.
AND IF WE SET PRECEDENT FOR A PLASTIC COMPOSITE, WE MIGHT BE OPENING THE DOOR.
MY KNOWLEDGE, WE HAVE NOT SET A PRECEDENT TO DATE IN REGARDS TO SOMETHING LIKE THAT FROM PRECEDENT IS THAT IT MEANS THAT IT MUST MEET THE DURABLE WOOD.
WE HAVE MADE AMENDMENTS TO THE UTO SINCE THEN, BUT NOTHING HAS BEEN PERMITTED AS AN ALTERNATE MATERIAL AT THIS TIME.
SO WITH PVC MATERIAL IN GENERAL, SO LIKE AN, A ZACK TRIM MATERIAL, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT'S NEVER BEEN APPROVED IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT? I KNOW OF SHAKING YOUR HEAD.
I WAS AGREEING IT HAS NOT BEEN, IT HAS NOT BEEN APPROVED LIKE OKAY.
KIND OF DUMB QUESTION, BUT WALK ME THROUGH AS FAR AS LIKE, I MEAN A PAINT THAT'S APPLIED TO LIKE EITHER A WOOD OR A METAL, LIKE THAT'S, IT'S GOING TO BE DIFFERENT.
I MEAN THE MAIN THING IS IT'S JUST A DIFFERENT MATERIAL.
SO WHEN LANE'S MENTIONING IS ONCE YOU OPENED THE DOOR TO PVC AND YOU START SEEING PVC FENCING AND IT COULD REALLY, YEAH.
YOU ALWAYS TALK ABOUT, BRING UP PRECEDENT QUITE OFTEN HERE RIGHT NOW.
I WOULD NEVER SUGGEST ANYTHING LIKE THAT FOR A PROJECT, BUT YOU KNOW WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO, I UNDERSTAND THIS IS A NICE PROJECT, BUT IT DOES OPEN THE DOOR TO A LOT OF, A LOT OF PRODUCTS THAT ARE NOT AS NICE QUALITY OF IT.
I THINK US, IT'S A MAINTENANCE THING.
YOU KNOW, WOOD SHUTTERS IS SOMETHING YOU HAVE TO KEEP UP THIS, YOU KNOW, WE'VE DONE THEM ON PROJECTS IN THE PAST AND FOR, YOU KNOW, DECADE AND A HALF AND NO COLOR FADE, NOTHING.
THESE THINGS STILL LOOK LIKE THEY'RE BRAND NEW.
SO THE IDEA WAS, YOU KNOW, KEEPING THAT, YOU KNOW, AS JOSH SAID OFF, KEEPING IT AUTHENTIC AS POSSIBLE, BUT MAKING SURE IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S DURABLE AS WELL.
[00:30:01]
LOOK AT HARDER WOODS OR ACETYLATED WOOD AND GET THAT, THAT REALLY DENSE.BUT ELAINE'S REFERRING TO IS THE UTO THAT WE FOLLOW IS THE RULES THAT WE DIDN'T SET THE UDL COMMISSIONED IN COUNCIL.
OF COURSE, WE'RE TRYING TO FOLLOW THAT.
AND IF WE OPEN THE DOOR UP ON ANY OF THOSE UDL ITEMS, THEN YOU'RE ALLOWING DIFFERENT PVC MATERIAL FOR OTHER, WELL, YOU DID IT HERE AND I HEAR IT A LOT.
BUT WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO IT OVER HERE, BUT YOU LIKED HIM BETTER.
SO IT MAKES IT REAL DIFFICULT FOR US TO UNDERSTAND, SEE PRODUCTS LIKE THIS, BUT YET WE'RE TRYING TO STICK WITH THE UDL.
THAT'S WHAT WE'VE BEEN GIVEN THE DUTY TO DO, RIGHT? YEAH.
WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE TO, I UNDERSTAND THE SLIPPERY SLOPE ARGUMENT THAT YOU'RE MAKING, BUT WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE TO LIMIT THIS OPTION TO I QUALITY SHUTTER AND NOT OPENED THAT DOOR WHEN EVERYTHING COMES BEFORE YOU DECIDED ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS, WELL, YOU LET THEM HAVE THE SHUTTERS.
WHY CAN'T I HAVE MY DOOR OUT OF THE SAME STUFF WHILE YOU LET ME HAVE THE DOOR OUT OF THIS STUFF? WHY CAN'T YOU LET ME HAVE THE FENCING OUT OF IT? IT DOES LEAD TO THE NEXT IT LEADS ON TO MORE AND MORE, UH, SITUATION.
AND I GUESS WE'RE KIND OF STICKING TO OUR GUNS IN REGARDS TO THAT.
I THINK, UM, YOU KNOW, TO THAT POINT OF YOU THINK ABOUT BUYING A WINDOWS, YOU SEE A LOT OF IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, YOU KNOW, IT'S SOMETHING THAT I DON'T NECESSARILY THINK IT'S A TERRIBLE PRODUCT, BUT YOU KNOW, THERE'S BETTER OPTIONS OUT THERE THERE SEEM MORE AUTHENTIC.
AND SO THAT WE CAN GET RID OF THE VINYL WINDOW THING AND
UM, YOU KNOW, REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE MATERIAL IS, IT WAS, IT WAS MORE ABOUT THE QUALITY OF IT.
SO, AND I KNOW THAT WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE THE UDO'S GOSH, YOU KNOW, I I'M I'M, I DON'T WANT TO UNDERVALUE THE UTO AND THE IMPORTANCE THAT, THAT, THAT IS WORKING TO, TO SET AS A PRECEDENT.
BUT ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE SPECTRUM, I ALSO HAVE ISSUE WITH SITE-BUILT WOOD SHUTTERS THAT ARE NOT MAINTAINED AND ARE APPEALING WITHIN SIX MONTHS OF BEING ERECTED.
THEY COST, YOU KNOW, A, A FRACTION OF THE AMOUNT OF A HIGH QUALITY DURABLE REPLICA, AND SUCH AS THE NEW HORIZON.
SO I THINK THAT THERE IS A BALANCE THERE.
AND I THINK THAT THIS IS ON THE, THE END OF THE SPECTRUM THAT DOES PUT ITSELF IN A POSITION FROM A CASE BY CASE BASIS.
YOU WOULDN'T COMPARE THIS TO SAY A VINYL FENCE, AS, AS IT RELATES TO THE SHUTTER IN THIS PIECE OF ARCHITECTURAL, UM, ADDITIONAL OR COMPLIMENTS TO THIS HOUSE.
I MIGHT ALSO JUST ADD THAT THE LANGUAGE UNDER THE SHUTTER MATERIAL, UM, THAT WAS UPDATED ORIGINALLY.
IT WAS JUST DURABLE WOOD FULL STOP.
NOW THE EXCEPTION IS EXCEPT IN THE CASE OF A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, WHICH THIS IS NOT THE UDL ADMINISTRATOR WE'RE IN THIS CASE, THE HPC IS THE REVIEW AUTHORITY, UM, MAY APPROVE THE USE OF WOOD COMPOSITE MATERIAL SHUTTERS PR PROVIDED THE UT ADMINISTRATOR, DETERMINES THAT THE SHUTTERS WILL BE CONSISTENT WITH THE CHARACTER OF HISTORIC DISTRICT AND THE MATERIALS, OR YOU USED ARE EQUAL OR BETTER QUALITY THAN TRADITIONAL BUILDING MATERIALS.
UM, SO IT DOES SPECIFY IN THERE FOR THE SHUTTERS WOOD COMPOSITE, UM, AND THEN FOR THE DOORS, WHICH WILL BE THE NEXT, THE NEXT SECTION THAT IS DISCUSSED FOLLOWING THIS, IF I CAN SPELL THE DOOR MATERIAL PERMITTED IS WOOD METAL, METAL CLAD, EXCEPT IN THE CASE OF A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, UH, THE USE OF A WOOD COMPOSITE MATERIAL FOR DOORS PROVIDED THE ADMINISTER, DETERMINES THAT THE DOOR WILL BE CONSISTENT WITH THE CHARACTER.
SO IT'S THE SAME, SAME LANGUAGE THERE FOR DOORS WHERE IT IS, UM, WOOD, METAL, METAL CLAD, OR IF FOUND TO BE A QUALITY MATERIAL, A WOOD COMPOSITE COULD BE AN EXCEPTION TO THE WOOD METAL OR METAL CLAD.
AND THEN FOR THE SHUTTERS OF WOOD COMPOSITE, IF FOUND TO BE A QUALITY OF MATERIAL, COULD BE AN EXCEPTION TO DURABLE WOOD, ALMOST EVERY HOUSE, NEW CONSTRUCTION AND ALL DOWN.
WHAT I MEAN, ARE THERE OTHER OPTIONS? YEAH, BUT THEY, I MEAN, THAT'S A VIABLE OPTION, IS IT NOT? I GUESS IF SOMEONE'S MAKING THE MOTION TO MAKE AN EXCEPTION THERE, YOU HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU VOICED YOUR ACCEPTION ON QUALITY AND IN OTHER WORDS, HATING IT.
SO IT BECOMES A HIGHER BAR IF THAT'S HOW ANYONE
[00:35:01]
WANTS TO MAKE A MOTION THERE.UM, WHEN YOU, YOU KNOW, REGARDING PRECEDENT, I THINK IF THERE WEREN'T OTHER OPTIONS, THEN THAT MAY BE A REASON TO SET A NEW PRECEDENT, BUT THERE ARE OTHER OPTIONS IN THIS CASE, YOU MAKE THE MOTION AND THAT PRECEDENT IS SET AND YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE AND CLARIFY THAT IT'S STATES QUALITY.
I THINK AS JOSH YOU'RE STATING MAYBE YOU COULD, UH, KIND OF ADDRESS THAT IN REGARDS TO THE HIGHER QUALITY AND, UH, THAT CONCEPT.
AND I WOULD ALSO ADD THAT IF WE WANTED TO CONSIDER AN EXCEPTION SPECIFICALLY, IN THIS CASE, IT'S PRESENTED AS A LOUVERED SHUTTER AND A PAINTED LOUVERED, SHUTTER BEING MANUFACTURED IN WOOD IS EXTREMELY RARE THESE DAYS, IF IT'S, IF IT IS BEING MANUFACTURED BY WOOD, IN ORDER FOR IT TO BE DURABLE ENOUGH TO HOLD UP, IT'S UNFORTUNATELY OUR, OUR PINES AND OUR MATERIALS THAT ARE, THAT ARE HARVESTED NOWADAYS.
THEY'RE NOT TYPICALLY DENSE ENOUGH TO BE ABLE TO STAND UP THROUGH OUR CONDITIONS.
SO IT'S BEING MADE FROM, UH, A MAHOGANY AS APPEALING AND NON-INDIGENOUS MATERIAL THAT'S, UM, THAT'S NOT SOURCED LOCALLY.
SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S ONE THING FOR A, A VERTICAL SHUTTER TO BE PROPOSED IN THIS, IN THIS FASHION, IT CAN BE BUILT, VERTICAL SHUTTERS CAN BE BUILT OUT OF WOOD, BUT A LOUVERED SHUTTER SUCH AS THIS, IT'S A COMPLIMENT TO THE AREA.
NOW THAT THAT IS MY HUMBLE OPINION, TO BE ABLE TO INCORPORATE A GREAT LOOKING PAINTED LOUVERED, SHUTTER, SUCH AS THIS, BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT GOING TO SEE IT IN WHAT I KNOW IN EMOTION.
YOU CAN'T SPECIFICALLY STATE OF MANUFACTURER, BUT YOU COULD DO A SPECIFICATION OR A I'M CALLING OUT THE MATERIAL TYPE SITUATION.
SO, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN'T CALL IT A WHATEVER SHUTTER THAT WAS, BUT YOU CAN SAY, YOU KNOW, AS SOMETHING THAT'S JUST IDEAS, THE CHAIRMAN, IF THE HPC MAKES A MOTION THAT ALLOWS FOR A SUBSTITUTE MATERIAL, THAT IS NOT THE ONE THAT IS BEFORE US TONIGHT OR DURABLE WOOD, UH, STAFF IS NOT COMFORTABLE MAKING THAT DETERMINATION ON ITS APPROPRIATENESS.
SO I WOULD LIKE IT TO GO BACK TO EITHER THE HPRC AT MINIMUM, UM, OR THE HPC, IF THAT'S THE, IF THAT'S THE DECISION TONIGHT, WELL, WE'RE SEEING THE MATERIAL, WE'RE SEEING THE PRODUCT, RIGHT? IF, IF IT'S THE ONE THAT IS BEFORE US TONIGHT, THAT IS THE EXCEPTION.
THAT IS IF Y'ALL THINK THAT THAT MATERIAL WORKS.
BUT IF YOU ALLOW FOR THEM TO USE A MATERIAL THAT IS NOT THE ONE WE ARE SEEING TONIGHT, BUT IT IS NOT DURABLE WOOD, THEN STAFF NEEDS THE HP C TO, TO SPEAK ON THAT MATERIAL CHOICE AND EMOTION.
CAN YOU STATE A MANUFACTURER HOW THAT WORKS, MR. CHAIRMAN, I WOULD RECOMMEND THAT YOU DO NOT INCLUDE A MANUFACTURER IN ANY OF YOUR MOTIONS BECAUSE THEY COULD OBVIOUSLY CREATE IT'S A SLIPPERY SLOPE.
SO YOU'RE JUST GOING TO BE STATING THE SPECIFICATIONS OF THAT PRODUCT.
WELL, I THINK IT, IT, IT ULTIMATELY COMES DOWN TO THE CRITERIA THAT GIVES, YOU KNOW, THE UDA DOES GIVE YOU ALL SOME DISCRETION AND THE UDL ADMINISTRATORS, SOME DISCRETION AND APPROVING A COMPOSITE MATERIAL, SOMETHING THAT IS NOT YOUR STANDARD WOULD, UH, IT'S REALLY THE TWO CRITERIA THAT YOU'RE, THAT KATIE WENT OVER EARLIER THAT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
AND TWO THAT THE MATERIALS YOU USE ARE OF EQUAL OR BETTER QUALITY THAN TRADITIONAL BUILDING MATERIALS AND IS WHETHER Y'ALL CAN HAVE UPON ABOUT WHY THIS PARTICULAR SHUTTER AND THIS PARTICULAR COMPOSITE MATERIAL PRESENTED TO YOU ALL TONIGHT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT AND IS, UH, OF A MATERIAL THAT'S EQUAL OR BETTER QUALITY THAN TRADITIONAL BUILDING MATERIALS.
UM, I KNOW WE ALWAYS ARE A LITTLE BIT CONCERNED ABOUT PRECEDENT.
AND SO WHEN YOU'RE IN PARTICULAR MAKING OR WHEN YOU'RE DISCUSSING THE MATERIAL, JUST BE VERY CLEAR ABOUT WHAT ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR MATERIAL.
AND THIS PARTICULAR SHUTTER MAKES IT A BETTER QUALITY THAN TRADITIONAL BUILDING MATERIALS.
AND CERTAINLY THE TYPE OF USE THAT IT'S GOING TO GO TO A SHUTTER VERSUS SAY, SOME OTHER BUILDING MATERIALS WOULD, UM, MAKE SOME DIFFERENCE.
SO Y'ALL, Y'ALL HAVE SOME LEEWAY THERE, BUT IT'S ULTIMATELY UP TO THE HPC, WHAT Y'ALL WANT TO DO.
THIS IS MADE OUT OF ALUMINUM PVC AND STYRENE.
THERE IS NO WOOD IN IT ANYWHERE, SO IT'S NOT EVEN A WOOD COMPOSITE.
YEAH, I GUESS, I MEAN, I'LL SAY I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND, UM, THE DESIRE TO HAVE IT.
I MEAN, THE MOMENT THAT I TOUCHED IT, IT WAS LIKE THAT'S METAL.
[00:40:01]
SO I DON'T KNOW.I COULDN'T, UH, I DON'T THINK I COULD SIGN OFF ON THIS, UM, SHUTTER THAT'S PRESENTED MEETING THAT REQUIREMENT AND IT'S, I GUESS IT COMES DOWN TO AN ARCHITECTURAL POINT.
YOU KNOW, IT'S SOMETHING WE'RE TRYING TO GO WITH THIS LOUVERED SHUTTER AND TO JOSH'S POINT, I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, TO GO WITH A WOOD SPECIES, IT'S BECOMING MORE AND MORE DIFFICULT TO, TO FABRICATE THAT IN SOME WAY WHERE IT BECOMES A DURABLE ELEMENT.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS KIND OF, THE PHILOSOPHY IS JUST, WE WANT TO KEEP THIS ARCHITECTURAL STYLE, THIS CHARLESTON STYLE, WHICH WAS THAT LOUVERED SHUTTER APPROACH.
AND THEY'RE NOT NECESSARILY OUR BOARD ON BOARD SHUTTER, HAVE YOU LOOKED INTO ACETYLATED WOOD? WE HAVE NOT, BUT THIS WAS A PRODUCT I'M VERY FAMILIAR WITH.
AND WE USE OFTEN, AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT I FELT LIKE IT WAS SUPERIOR IN A LOT OF WAYS.
SO IN OTHER WORDS, THERE'S OTHER OPTIONS OUT THERE FOR FAMILIAR WITH OTHER OPTIONS.
AND ARE THERE OTHER OPTIONS OUT THERE THAT WOULD, THERE ARE, THERE ARE WOOD COMPOSITES THAT ARE NOT PLASTIC.
THERE'S NO SHUTTERS, THERE'S HARDWOOD, SHUTTERS, THERE'S A SATELLITE OF WOOD SHUTTERS.
THEY COULD LOOK AT ANY FURTHER DISCUSSIONS ON THIS FURTHER COMMENTS, STAFF, APPLICANT.
I HAVE ANYTHING ELSE TO ADD FOR THE SHUTTERS.
ANYONE HERE, MY MOUSE DOESN'T WORK, UM, ON THIS TABLE.
I HAVE TO BE OVER THERE, WHICH IS JUST, I KNOW, STAY THERE.
I'M JUST TALKING INTO THE MIC.
AND INSTEAD THOUGH, UM, THE ITEMS THAT NEED SPECIFIC DIRECTION, IF YOU WERE TO, IF YOU WERE TO LIKE THE WORDING OF STAFF'S COMMENTS ITEMS 2, 3, 7, AND EIGHT, DO NEED SOMETHING FROM YOU ALL.
UM, BECAUSE IT IS THE DETERMINATION ON THE BUILDING TYPE.
IF IT IS NOT A SIDE YARD, THEN THREE NEEDS A DETERMINATION.
IF IT IS THEN THREE COULD BE SKIPPED.
UM, AND THEN IF YOU COULD HIT THE DOWN ARROW FOR ME, UM, AND THEN SEVEN AND EIGHT ARE THE DOOR AND SHUTTER MATERIAL ITEMS. SO THOSE YOU HAVE HAVE DISCUSSED, BUT, UM, JUST MAKE SURE THAT YOU ARE CONSIDERING THOSE OTHER OPTIONS.
THE STAFF IS LOOKING FOR A DETERMINATION THAT, THAT IS THERE ANYONE WILLING TO MAKE A MOTION? I'LL BE WILLING TO GIVE IT A TRY IF WE CAN GO BACK UP ONE PAGE SO I CAN SEE THAT TOP PORTION.
SO LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT WE APPROVE THE APPLICANT AS SUBMITTED WITH THE DETERMINATION THAT THE DESIGN DOES MEET THE INTENT OF A SIDE YARD RESIDENCE, OR SIDE YARD STRUCTURE, WHICH TAKES CARE OF ITEMS TWO AND THREE.
AND THEN IF WE CAN GO TO THE NEXT PAGE AND THAT THE SHUTTERS, AS WELL AS THE DOOR MATERIALS WILL BE RESUBMITTED TO STAFF FOR FINAL APPROVAL, WHICH WOULD TAKE CARE OF SEVEN AND EIGHT GOOD TEAM, MR. CHAIRMAN, IF I UNDERSTOOD THE MOTION THAT JOSH MADE, IT WAS THAT IT WAS PER STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION WITH ITEM TWO, MEETING THE BUILDING TYPE, WHICH NEGATES THREE, AND THAT SEVEN AND EIGHT BE RESUBMITTED TO STAFF FOR REVIEW AT ALL.
THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING, IS THAT CORRECT? YES.
WELL, JOSH, YOU COULD YOU, UH, STATE, UH, APPROVAL LET'S LET ME CLARIFY THAT BY HPRC, AS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE MATERIALS ASSOCIATED WITH THE SHUTTERS AND THE DOORS, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT IT GO BACK TO HPRC AND APPROPRIATE.
UM, AND BEFORE WE SECOND, LET'S JUST, UH, UM, PARDON ME, MR. CHAIRMAN
UM, JUST, BUT BEFORE WE, BEFORE WE GET A SECOND, LET'S JUST REITERATE THAT MOTION JUST FOR THE SAKE OF CLARITY AS A MOTION, APPROVE THE APPLICATION WITH THE CONDITIONS OUTLINED IN THE STAFF REPORT, SUBJECT TO A DETERMINATION THAT THE BUILDING TIME MEETS THE SIDE YARD, UH, BUILDING TYPE REQUIREMENT AND THAT THE POST MATERIALS FOR THE SHUTTER AND THE DOOR WILL BE SUBMITTED TO STAFF IN HPRC FOR A FINAL DETERMINATION AS TO, UM, WHETHER IT MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE UDA.
WELL, THAT'S WHY HE'S AN ATTORNEY.
I'VE HAD SOME PRACTICE THINGS THAT'S IN PRACTICE.
[00:45:01]
UH, CAN I GET A SECOND ON THAT? I SAID, OH, YOU HAVE TO, CAN WE HAVE ANY FURTHER DISCUSSIONS? AND LET'S SAY, WE'LL VOTE ON THIS MOTION, UH, ALL APPROVE, AYE, AYE, ANY OPPOSED.UM, AND IT GOES AND COMES BACK TO HPRC.
SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO WAIT FOR A MONTH AND THEN HPRC MEETS ONCE A WEEK.
SO WITH THOSE, AND I DO HAVE TO SAY THAT, UH, YOU DID LISTEN AND, YOU KNOW, LOOKING THROUGH THIS, IT WAS A QUITE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE FRONT DOOR AND ALL THOSE, IT MADE IT LOOK PRETTY NICE.
I THOUGHT IT WAS A GOOD LOOKING PROJECT.
FIT ON SUCH AS, YOU KNOW, INTERESTING, HARD TO FIT, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU SAW THE CHALLENGES, THE FOLKS OUT THERE, BUT VERY CHALLENGING AND, UH, CAME BEFORE US A COUPLE OF TIMES TO GET THAT THING SQUEEZED IN.
WELL, WE'LL BE HAPPY TO MAKE SOME OF THESE ADJUSTMENTS AS NEEDED AND RESUBMIT FOR, UH, FOR STAFF LEVEL APPROVAL.
YOU GUYS WERE OLD BUSINESS BY THE WAY.
DID YOU KNOW THAT WE'RE ON TWO NEW BUSINESS ON THE AGENDA AND IT LOOKS LIKE, UH, OPENED UP.
WE HAVE GLEN, IS THAT CORRECT? YES, SIR.
GLEN, YOU'RE GOING TO BE DOING THE PRESENTATION.
UM, THIS IS A, UH, APPLICATION FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR A DEMOLITION, UH, THE CO APPLICANTS, THE KESSLER ENTERPRISE AND TAIWAN SCOTT ON BEHALF OF THE OWNER, UH, DOROTHY J. SINGLETON REQUESTED THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION APPROVED THE FOLLOWING APPLICATION.
UM, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS DEMOLITION TO ALLOW FOR THE DEMOLITION OF AN EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE OF APPROXIMATELY 1,516 SQUARE FEET KNOWN AS THE JOINER HOUSE AND NON-CONTRACT NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES, INCLUDING A SINGLE-STORY BARBECUE SHED AND A BRICK OVEN GRILL OF APPROXIMATELY 326 FEET, A SHED OF APPROXIMATELY ONE SQUARE FEET AND A METAL SHED OF APPROXIMATELY 78 SQUARE FEET, ALL LOCATED AT NINE PERIN ROAD IN THE OLD TOWN, BLUFFTON HISTORIC DISTRICT AND ZONED NEIGHBORHOOD CORE HD GLENN, CAN YOU HOLD ON ONE SECOND, IF I COULD, FOR THE RECORD, UM, JESSE SOLOMON DID STEP DOWN AND IS RECUSED HIMSELF FROM THIS APPLICATION.
WE STILL HAVE A QUORUM, CORRECT? YES.
UM, THE YELLOW STAR INDICATES THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, UM, IMMEDIATELY TO THE LEFT OF THAT IS BLUFFTON ROAD BELOW THAT AS BRUIN ROAD.
UM, AND, UM, THAT'S THE CORNER OF THE, UM, WHERE THE PROPERTY IS LOCATED, UM, FOR YOUR REFERENCE ALSO IS A ZONING MAP.
AGAIN, SHOWING YOU THE BLUE STAR.
UM, THIS IS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD CORE HD AND THAT DARK RED COLOR, UM, REPRESENTING THE ZONING DISTRICT.
UM, A COPY OF THE SURVEY PLAN.
I'M SHOWING THE HOUSE, UM, IN THE, IN THE CORNER OF THE PROPERTY AND SOME PHOTOGRAPHS FOR YOU.
THIS IS, UM, THE SOUTH OR THE BRUIN ROAD, UM, FACADE OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
UM, I GAVE YOU SOME INFORMATION ABOUT THE JOINER HOUSE ITSELF ORIGINALLY CONSTRUCTED IN THE 1930S, ALTERED AT THE 1970S.
UM, AGAIN, 15 HUNDREDS, 16 SQUARE FEET, ONE STORY WOOD FRAME, RECTANGULAR PLAN.
UM, THE ORIGINAL 1930 SECTION IS, IS ON BRICK PIERS.
UM, THE NOT HISTORIC ADDITION IS ON CONCRETE BLOCK PEERS, UM, WITH A FRONT-FACING GABLE ROOF WITH LAP SIDING EXPOSED RAFTERS AT THE EAS METAL ROOF.
UM, THE SCREEN PORCH WITH BRICK ENTRY STEPS.
THERE'S A SECONDARY ENTRANCE, WHICH WE'LL SEE IN A MOMENT WITH W WITH COVERED PORTICO SUPPORTED BY RAW IRON COLUMNS AND CONCRETE STEPS.
UM, THE WEST ELEVATION FROM BLUFFTON ROAD.
UM, YOU'LL SEE, UM, TO THE, UM, RIGHT IS THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE ON THE BRICK PIERS, UH, WHICH IS THE SOUTH PORTION OF THE BUILDING NORTH PORTION OF THE BUILDING IS TO YOUR LEFT.
UM, ON THE CONCRETE PIERS, NOT VISIBLE FROM THE ROAD IS THE EAST ELEVATION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
UM, TWO PHOTOGRAPHS THERE, AND THEN THE NORTH ELEVATION, WHICH IS THE NEW SECTION OF THE BUILDING, UM, UM, WHICH IS THE NORTHERN PORTION OF THE BUILDING
[00:50:01]
OF THE NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES ON THE PROPERTY.JUST FOR YOUR OWN REFERENCE, WE HAVE A BARBECUE SHED.
UM, HERE'S AN INTERIOR PHOTOGRAPH OF THE BARBECUE SHED.
AGAIN, IT'S A NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
UM, NON-CONTRIBUTING METAL SHED ON THE PROPERTY AS WELL AS A NON-CONTRIBUTING WELL ENCLOSURE THERE FOR THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
THE JOINER HOUSE IN 2001, UM, SOUTH CAROLINA DOES HAS A SHORT RESERVATION SURVEY TO DOCUMENT THE AFRICAN AMERICAN STRUCTURES.
UM, 33 WERE INCLUDED ON THE LIST, INCLUDING THE SUBJECT STRUCTURE, WHICH WAS IDENTIFIED AT THAT TIME IS 2 0 9 PLAFOND ROAD, A 2008 STATEWIDE HISTORIC RESOURCE SERVERY.
UH, THE SUBJECT WAS ALSO INCLUDED AN IDENTIFIED AS THE JOINER HOUSE AT 2 0 9 BLUFFTON ROAD.
AND THEN THE 2008 HISTORIC RESOURCE SURVEY.
THE TOWN COUNCIL PASSED A RESOLUTION ON OCTOBER 1ST, 2008, ADOPTING THAT SURVEY, WHICH IDENTIFIED THE JOINER HOUSE AT 2 0 9 BLUFFTON ROAD AS A LOCAL CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE TO THE OLD TOWN BLUFFTON HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE UGA DEFINES THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE AS ANY PROPERTY STRUCTURE OR ARCHITECTURAL RESOURCE, WHICH WAS DESIGNATED CONTRIBUTING IN THE BLUFFTON HISTORIC DISTRICTS IN 1996, NOMINATE GET NOMINATIONS OF THE NATIONAL REGISTER OR IN THE MOST RECENT BLUFFTON HISTORIC RESOURCE SURVEY, OR ANY STRUCTURE DESIGNATED AS CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE AS PROVIDED FOR IN SECTION 3.25, IT'S A COMPLETE DEMOLITION OF, OF A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE OR REMOVAL OF A CONTINUOUS STRUCTURE FOR THE BLUFFTON HISTORIC RESOURCE SURVEY SHALL CAUSE THE STRUCTURE TO NO LONGER BE CONSIDERED CONTRIBUTING.
WE REACHED OUT TO THE SEVERAL LOCAL PRESERVATION GROUPS FOR COMMENTS AS OF, UH, AUGUST 31ST, UM, THE HISTORIC BLUFFTON FOUNDATION COMMENT.
WE DO HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT THE, THE HISTORIC STRUCTURES AT NINE BURN ROAD DUE TO THEIR SIGNIFICANCE TO BLUFFTON STORY.
OUR MAIN POINTS OF CONCERN ARE THE HISTORY OF THE PROPERTY, THE CONDITION OF THE STRUCTURES AND THE CONTEXT OF THE SITE.
UM, PALMETTO BLUFF CONSERVANCY, UH, COMMENT THAT WE HAVE NO OBJECTIVES TO THE REMOVAL OF THIS SITE FROM THE LIST OF CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES.
UM, THE OTHER GROUPS DID NOT MAKE ANY COMMENTS AND IT'S NOT SHARING PROPERLY, THUMBS UP.
THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION ACTIONS HPC SHALL CONSIDER THE EIGHT REVIEW CRITERIA SET FORTH IN SECTION THREE POINT 18.3 AND SECTION THREE POINT 18.4 OF THE UDL WHEN ASSESSING AN APPLICATION FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR DEMOLITION.
FURTHERMORE, THE HBC IS AUTHORIZED TO TAKE THE FOLLOWING ACTION, APPROVE THE APPLICATION AS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT, APPROVE THE APPLICATION WITH CONDITIONS, DENY THE APPLICATION AS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT OR POSTPONE A DECISION ON THE APPLICATION FOR NO MORE THAN 180 DAYS TO DETERMINE IF ALTERNATE ALTERNATIVES TO DEMOLITION EXIST.
I'LL TAKE YOU THROUGH THE, UM, OH, I JUST DON'T REVIEW CRITERIA.
UM, AGAIN, SECTION THREE POINT 18 THREE POINT 18.4, UM, HPC MAY CHOOSE TO PURSUE POSTPONE IT DECISION ON THE DEMOLITION OF REQUESTS FOR NO MORE THAN 180 DAYS.
IF IT FINDS THAT AS IN THE PUBLIC INTEREST TO PRESERVE AND PROTECT THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE IN WHOLE OR IN PART DURING POSTPONEMENT HPC SHALL CONSIDER WHAT ALTERNATIVES TO DEMOLITION EXISTS AND THEN MAKE ITS RECOMMENDATION TO TOWN COUNCIL.
AND THE APPLICANTS AT MINIMUM CONSIDERATION SHALL INCLUDE ALTERNATIVES FOR PRESERVATION OF THE STRUCTURE IN WHOLE, OR IN PART THAT INCLUDES CONSULTATION WITH CIVIC GROUPS, PRIVATE CITIZENS, AND OTHER PUBLIC OR PRIVATE AGENCIES AND BOARDS, OR IF ALTERNATIVES CAN NOT BE IDENTIFIED IN THE PRESERVATION IS CLEARLY IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE GENERAL WELFARE OF THE COMMUNITY AND HAVE CERTAIN HISTORIC AND ARCHITECTURAL SIGNIFICANCE INVESTIGATION OF ACQUISITION BY THE TOWN OF BLUFFTON.
IF NO ALTERNATIVE IS RECOMMENDED DURING THE POSTPONEMENT PERIOD, THE HBC SHALL TAKE ACTION AT ITS NEXT REGULARLY SCHEDULED HPC MEETING.
I'LL TAKE YOU THROUGH THE VARIOUS RECOMMENDED REVIEW CRITERIA UNDER SECTION THREE POINT 18.
THIS IS THREE POINT 18.3 POINT A CONSISTENCY WITH THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION AND GUIDELINES FOR RE REHABILITATING HISTORIC BUILDINGS BECAUSE DEMOLITION HAS REQUESTED THIS CRITERIA IS NOT APPLICABLE
[00:55:03]
THREE POINT B CONSISTENCY WITH THE PRINCIPLES SET FORTH IN THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN.THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN STATES THAT HISTORIC STRUCTURES IN OLD TOWNS SHOULD BE PRESERVED AND RESTORED TO THEIR ORIGINAL USE OR ADAPTED TO NEW USES WHEN APPROPRIATE AND THE BUILT ENVIRONMENT IN PARTICULAR, THE HISTORIC STRUCTURES SCATTERED THROUGHOUT OLD TOWN SHOULD BE PROTECTED AND ENHANCED AND DECISIONS MADE NOW AND IN THE FUTURE SHOULD BE DRIVEN BY PRESERVATION AND PROTECTION.
IT IS GOOD FOR MAINTAINING THE COMMUNITY CHARACTER AND QUALITY OF LIFE THAT MAKES OLD TOWN WHAT IT IS TODAY.
AND IT CONTRIBUTES TO THE ECONOMIC SUCCESS AND STABILITY OF THE TOWN AS SUCH.
THE COMPLETE DEMOLITION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE PRINCIPLES IN THE OLD TOWN, BLUFFTON MASTER PLAN, SUBSECTION C THE APPLICATION APPLICATION MUST BE IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE APPLICABLE PROVISIONS, PROVIDED AN ARTICLE FIVE DESIGN STANDARDS.
THIS CRITERIA IS NOT APPLICABLE AS THIS STANDARD IS INTENDED TO REGULATE AND GUIDE NEW CONSTRUCTION AND NOT DEMOLITIONS SUBSECTION D THE NATURE AND CHARACTER OF THE SURROUNDING AREA AND CONSISTENCY OF THE STRUCTURE WITH THE SCALE FORM AND BUILDING PROPORTIONS OF THE SURROUNDING NEIGHBORHOOD.
THIS CRITERIA AGAIN, IS NOT APPLICABLE AS THE STANDARD IS INTENDED TO REGULATE AND NEW CONSTRUCTION AND NOT DEMELZA DEMOLITIONS SUBSECTION E THE PRESERVATION OF THE EXISTING BUILDINGS, HISTORIC CHARACTER AND ARCHITECTURE.
THE DEMOLITION OF THE NON HISTORIC PORTION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE WOULD IN FACT, PRESERVE THE HISTORIC CHARACTER, AN ARCHITECTURE OF THE 1930S ERA CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
UM, PARAGRAPH F THE HISTORIC ARCHITECTURAL AND AESTHETIC FEATURES OF THE STRUCTURE INCLUDE THE EXTENT TO WHICH ITS ALTERATION AT REMOVAL WILL BE DETRIMENTAL TO THE PUBLIC INTEREST.
THE JOINER HOUSE HAS REPRESENTED BLUFFTON EARLY 20TH CENTURY FOR NECKLACE ARCHITECTURE AND ITS PHYSICAL HISTORY.
THE REMOVAL OF CONTROL OF A CONTINUING STRUCTURE WITHIN THE OLD TOWN.
BLUFFTON HISTORIC DISTRICT IS GENERALLY DETRIMENTAL TO THE INTEGRITY OF THE DISTRICTS AND TO THE PUBLIC INTEREST.
IN THIS CASE, SINCE THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE WAS ALTERED IN THE 1970S, WITH THE ADDITION OF THE NORTHERN HALF OF THIS STRUCTURE, THE REMOVAL OF THAT ALTERATION WOULD ARGUABLY RESTORE THE HISTORIC ARCHITECTURAL AND AESTHETIC FEATURES OF THE STRUCTURE AND IMPROVE THE INTEGRITY OF THE DISTRICT.
HOWEVER, A FULL-SCALE DEMOLITION AND REMOVAL OF THE ENTIRE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE WOULD BE DETRIMENTAL TO THE INTEGRITY OF THE DISTRICT AND TO THE PUBLIC INTEREST SECTION THREE POINT 18.3 POINT G 0.1, THE EXISTING IN HISTORICAL OWNERSHIP AND USE OF THE REASON FOR DEMO AND REASON FOR THE REQUESTING DEMOLITION.
THE JOINER HOUSE APPEARS TO HAVE BEEN USED AS A DWELLING SINCE ITS CONSTRUCTION.
AND THE APPLICANT INDICATES THAT THERE'S NO CONNECTION TO PERSONS WHO WERE SIGNIFICANT TO LOCAL REGIONAL STATE OR NATIONAL HISTORY OBSESSION G TO A, THE DEMOLITION OF THE STRUCTURE IS NECESSARY TO ALLEVIATE A THREAT TO HEALTH, PUBLIC HEALTH, OR PUBLIC SAFETY.
AN APRIL, 2019 STRUCTURAL ASSESSMENT FOUNDED BASED UPON THE OVERALL STRUCTURAL CONDITION OF THE STRUCTURE.
IT WOULD NOT BE COST EFFECTIVE TO REHABILITATE IT.
AND THE PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER REDNECK RECOMMENDED THAT THE BUILDING BE DEMOLISHED AND AN UPDATED 2021 ASSESSMENT FURTHER KNOW THAT THAT STRUCTURE WAS IN THE SAME, IF NOT WORSE, DILAPIDATED CONDITION AND CONCLUDED THAT THE BUILDING WAS BEYOND REASONABLE REPAIR AND PHYSICALLY NOT SAFE FOR OCCUPANCY AND A SITE INSPECTION IN JULY, 2021 NOTED BASED UPON THE VARYING STAGES OF DECAY THAT CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE WOULD REQUIRE A SIGNIFICANT RESTORATION WHILE THIS REPORT INDICATES THAT THE STRUCTURE IS NOT HABITABLE IN ITS CURRENT STATE.
IT DOES NOT SPECIFICALLY STATE THAT THE STRUCTURE IS A THREAT TO PUBLIC HEALTH AND SAFETY SUBSECTION G TWO B NO OTHER REASONABLE ALTERNATIVES TO DEMOLITION EXIST.
THE APRIL, 2019 ENGINEERING REPORT NOTED THAT BASED ON THE OVERALL STRUCTURAL CONDITION OF THE BUILDING AND THE FACT THAT IN THE ENGINEER'S OPINION, THERE IS NO INHERIT EXTRAORDINARY OR FEATURES, AND THAT IT WOULD NOT BE COST EFFECTIVE TO REHABILITATE I EVER MET THE MEN THAT THE BUILDING BE DEMOLISHED FURTHER, THE UPDATED 2021 REPORT NOTED THAT DUE TO THE CURRENT CONDITION AND STRUCTURAL DEFICIENCIES, IT WOULD NOT BE FEASIBLE TO RELOCATE IT TO ANOTHER SITE.
CPW ENGINEERING ALSO NOTED THAT THE STRUCTURES AT THIS SITE ARE HAZARDOUS, UNSAFE, UNFIT FOR OCCUPANCY, AND SHOULD BE DEMOLISHED SUB PARAGRAPH TWO G C THE DENIAL OF THE APPLICATION AS A RESULT OF THE REGULATIONS AND STANDARDS OF THIS SECTION DEPRIVED THE APPLICANT OF REASONABLE ECONOMIC USE
[01:00:01]
OF, OR RETURN ON THE PROPERTY.THE APPLICATION FOR DEMOLITION MAY NOT DENY THE PROPERTY OWNERS, REASONABLE ECONOMIC USE OR RETURN OF THE PROPERTY.
THEREFORE, THE STRUCTURE COULD BE REHABILITATED FOR HABITATION OR ADAPTED FOR OTHER USES AND SECTION THREE POINT 18.3 POINT H THE APPLICATION MUST COMPLY WITH APPLICABLE REQUIREMENTS IN THE APPLICATIONS MANDIBLE.
THE APPLICATION HAS BEEN REVIEWED BY TOWN STAFF AND HAS BEEN DETERMINED TO BE COMPLETE AND MEETS ALL THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE APPLICATIONS.
THE STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION APPROVE THE WHOLESALE DEMOLITION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE KNOWN AS THE JOINER HOUSE.
HOWEVER, BASED ON THE FINDINGS THAT THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE WAS ALTERED TO THE 1970S, WITH THE ADDITION OF THE NORTHERN HALF OF THE STRUCTURE AND THE REMOVAL OF THAT ALTERATION WOULD RESTORE THE HISTORIC ARCHITECTURAL IS THE FEATURES OF THE STRUCTURE, AND THEREFORE WOULD IMPROVE THE INTEGRITY OF THE DISTRICT TOWN STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION APPROVED THE PARTIAL DEMOLITION OF THE NON HISTORIC PORTION OR THE NORTH PORTION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
ONE OF YOUR FIRST SLIDES SAID THAT THIS BUILDING WAS INCLUDED AS ONE OF 33, UM, BUILDINGS ON A STATEWIDE INVENTORY.
WAS THAT 33 IN THIS AREA OR 33 STATEWIDE? MY UNDERSTANDING WAS IT WAS 33 IDENTIFIED AS AFRICAN AMERICAN RELATED STRUCTURES IN THIS AREA, GEOGRAPHIC AREA IN THIS GEOGRAPHIC AREA, BLUFFTON, BLUFFTON.
MY QUESTION IS, UM, ONE THING IS, AS ELAINE JUST MENTIONED, IT WAS IDENTIFIED AS A HISTORICAL, UM, RELEVANT STRUCTURE, BUT THEN WHEN YOU WENT BACK, UM, IT WAS STATED THAT THERE WAS NO HISTORICAL RELEVANCE TO THE BILLING IN TERMS OF THE PRIOR OWNER.
COULD YOU CLARIFY THAT? BECAUSE I'M CONFUSED.
WHAT IS, WHAT IS THE ACTUAL RELEVANT IN HISTORY BEHIND THIS, THIS, THIS, THE STRUCTURE.
SO THEY CAN, SO THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE ITSELF, THAT FITS INTO THE TIMELINES AND MAKES IT WHAT MAKES THE BUILDING HISTORIC IS ACTUALLY THAT SOUTHERN PORTION THAT DATES FROM THE 1930S, UM, OTHER CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT ALL HAVE A TIMELINE AND A HISTORIC SETTING.
UM, SO IN THIS CASE, THAT CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE IS ACTUALLY TECHNICALLY ONLY THAT SOUTHERN PORTION OR THAT SOUTHERN HALF OF THE BUILDING.
AGAIN, THE THREE, UM, CLASS THREE REASONS FROM MAKING A BUILDING CONTRIBUTING.
WAS IT, UM, SIGNIFICANT EVENT? SIGNIFICANT ERA.
SO THERE'S, THERE'S ACTUALLY, SO IN DESIGNATING A CONSERVATIVE STRUCTURE, THERE'S 10 CRITERIA YOU CAN LOOK AT.
UM, ONE IS THE STRUCTURE HAS SIGNIFICANT INHERENT CHARACTER INTEREST OR VALUE AS PART OF THE DEVELOPMENT OR HERITAGE OF THE TOWN REGION, STATE, OR THE NATION.
UM, THE STRUCTURE IS THE SITE OF AN EVENT SIGNIFICANT IN HISTORY, THE STRUCTURE IS ASSOCIATED WITH A PERSON OR PERSONS WHO CONTRIBUTED SIGNIFICANTLY TO THE CULTURE AND DEVELOPMENT OF THE TOWN REGION, STATE, OR NATION.
UH, THE STRUCTURE EXEMPLIFIES THE CULTURAL, POLITICAL, ECONOMIC, SOCIAL, ETHNIC, OR HISTORIC HERITAGE OF THE TOWN REGION, STATE, OR NATION.
UM, THE STRUCTURE INDIVIDUALLY, OR AS A COLLECTION OF RESOURCES EMBODIES DISTINGUISHING CHARACTERISTICS OF AN ARCHITECTURAL TYPE STYLE PERIOD OR SPECIMEN IN ARCHITECTURE OR ENGINEERING.
UM, THE STRUCTURE IS THE WORK OF A DESIGNER WHOSE WORK HAS INFLUENCED SIGNIFICANTLY IN THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE TOWN REGION, STATE, OR NATION.
UM, THE STRUCTURE CONTAINS ELEMENTS OF DESIGN, DETAILED MATERIALS OR CRAFTSMANSHIP, WHICH REPRESENT A SIGNIFICANT INNOVATION THAT STRUCTURES PART OF, OR RELATED TO A COVE OR OTHER DISTINCTIVE ELEMENT OF THE COMMUNITY.
THE STRUCTURE REPRESENTS AN ESTABLISHED AND FAMILIAR VISUAL FEATURE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR TOWN AND THE STRUCTURE OR THE STRUCTURE HAS YIELDED OR MAY LIKELY TO YIELD INFORMATION IMPORTANT TO PRE-HISTORY OR HISTORY HAVE A QUESTION IN THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN, READING THROUGH A LOT OF THIS MATERIAL THAT WAS SUPPLIED.
UM, INTERESTINGLY IN THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN, THE TOWN HALL WAS ACTUALLY SHOWN IN THIS LOCATION.
MY QUESTION ABOUT IF THE TOWN HALL WAS SHOWN IN THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN BACK THEN, THAT MEANS THAT THIS BUILDING WOULD HAVE BEEN MOVED DEMOLISHED OR SOMETHING.
SO HOW DID THAT EVENT OCCUR? AND I GUESS I, AFTER READING THAT, IT'S LIKE HELP ME OUT WITH THAT.
[01:05:01]
IF THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN SHOWED IT AND WE'RE FOLLOWING THE OLD TOM MASTER PLAN, BUT THEN IT SHOWED THAT IT WAS NO LONGER THERE BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE TOWN HALL WAS LOCATED.IT'S KIND OF CONFUSING, ISN'T IT? THERE MIGHT OTHERS HERE WHO CAN SPEAK TO THAT BETTER THAN I, SINCE I'M STILL NEW.
WELL, BUT I GUESS I'M PRESENTED A FAIR, A FAIR QUESTION.
ALWAYS THE TENT OF THAT, RIGHT.
WELL, IF, IF IT WAS INVOLVED IN ALL OF THE PLANNING FOR THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN, THAT'S PRETTY INTENSE FOLKS THAT WERE DOING ALL THAT.
AND THERE WAS A LOT OF PEOPLE INVOLVED.
SO THEREFORE, SO THE OLD TOWN PLAN, WHAT YEAR WAS THAT? 2006.
SO THAT OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN ACTUALLY PREDATES THIS BEING LISTED AS A CONTRIBUTING, CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
SO CONTRIBUTING, THIS WAS LABELED AS A CONTRIBUTOR STRUCTURE IN OH EIGHT.
SO THIS CAME AFTER THE OLD TOWN PLAN.
THEN THE, HEY, CAN WE HAVE THE APPLICANTS? UH, KEVIN, WHAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT IS THEY KNOW THE APPLICANT HAS THE ABILITY TO SPEAK AND THEN FAMILY, AND THEN COMMENTS.
IS THAT THE WAY WE'RE DOING IT THEN ONCE AGAIN? YES, SIR.
I DID NOT WANT TO LIMIT THE FAMILY MEMBERS TWO TO THREE MINUTES DURING THE PUBLIC HEARING, UH, COMPONENTS SINCE THEY ARE THE, THE OWNERS OF THE PROPERTY.
UH, SO, UH, THE APPLICANTS ARE HERE TO SPEAK, ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS AS WELL AS TO HAVE THE OWNERS, UH, STAND UP AND SPEAK AS WELL.
BUT WE'RE HAVING THE APPLICANT FIRST, CORRECT? THAT IS CORRECT.
AND YOU'LL THE PODIUM YOU'LL VIEW THE PULLIAM TO THE APPLICANT AND I'D TAKE IT.
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TWO FOLKS FROM THE APPLICANT HERE.
AND IF YOU COULD INTRODUCE YOURSELF AND, UH, LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE.
WE'RE, CO-APPLICANT ALONG WITH THE JOIN, OUR FAMILY ON THIS APPLICATION FOR DEMOLITION OR RELOCATION, UM, WOMEN STANDING NEXT TO YOU AND YOU THAT JUST MESSED THE COMPUTER UP.
I'LL JUST BE YOUR TECH LIKE ME TO CONTINUE.
I MEAN, IF YOU DON'T NEED THE COMPUTER, IF YOU WANT TO, YOU DON'T MIND TALKING OVER YOUR SHOULDER, WOULD YOU LIKE TO? OKAY, SURE.
SO WE WENT THROUGH A PROCESS OF REALLY STUDYING ALL THE DIFFERENT OPTIONS, STUDYING THE SITE, STUDYING THE STRUCTURE.
THE FIRST THING I'D MENTIONED HAS BEEN WORKING WITH THE JOYNER FAMILY FOR PROBABLY SIX OR NINE MONTHS ON THIS SITE.
UM, SO THE FIRST THING I WANTED TO DO WAS UNDERSTAND THE HISTORICAL CONTEXT OF THE FAMILY ON THE SITE.
THEY'VE BEEN OVER ON THE PARTICULAR SITE CIPHER OVER A HUNDRED YEARS.
UM, AND THERE'S VARIOUS STORIES THAT THEY CAN SHARE WITH YOU OF THEIR HISTORY THERE.
SO THAT WAS THE FIRST PROCESS OF THE STUDY.
WE THEN FOLLOWED UP WITH ENGINEERING REPORTS.
UH, WE DID THE JOYNER FAMILY, HAD AN ENGINEERING REPORT DONE IN 2019 TO ANALYZE THE STRUCTURE, THE HISTORICAL CONTEXT, THE ARCHITECTURAL CONTEXT.
UH, WE FOLLOWED THAT WITH AN UPDATED REPORT AND THEN WE WENT ONE STEP FURTHER AND HAD THE COURT ATKINS GROUP OUT OF BLUFFTON, DO A COMPLETELY NEW, UM, STUDY AS WELL, BOTH OF WHICH ARE PROVIDED IN THE APPLICATION.
OUR THIRD, OUR FIRST THOUGHT AND INTENTION AFTER READING THE ENGINEERING REPORTS WERE TO FIND A WAY TO REUSE AS MANY OF THE HISTORICAL MATERIALS OF THE STRUCTURE AS POSSIBLE IN THE NEW DEVELOPMENT PLAN, TO TELL THE STORY IN A NEW WAY, TO TELL THE STORY OF THE FAMILY OF THEIR CULTURE AND OF THEIR TRADITIONS AND OF THE STRUCTURE ITSELF IN A NEW WAY IN THE NEW DEVELOPMENT.
SO WE ANALYZED ALL THOSE AND SAVING SOME OF THE BRICK FROM THE BARBECUE SHED AND DOING A NEW BARBECUE SHED ON THE CORNER FOR THE PUBLIC TO BE ABLE TO USE AND ENJOY, AND REALLY BRINGING ALL THE MATERIALS WE POSSIBLY COULD BACK TO A NEW LIFE AND A NEW REPURPOSING TO TELL THE STORY IN A NEW WAY, UM, WAS OUR, WAS OUR INTENTION.
WE THEN, UM, CONTINUED TO MEET WITH INDIVIDUALS IN THE LOCAL COMMUNITY TO HEAR THEIR THOUGHTS.
WE HEARD THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, RELOCATION WAS SOMETHING THAT MANY PEOPLE SUPPORTED.
WE HAVE NO ISSUE WITH RELOCATION.
UH, WE'VE SPOKEN TO MANY, UH, RECORDING IN PROGRESS INDIVIDUALS IN, UM, THE, UH, BLUFFTON COMMUNITY THAT ARE OPEN TO RECEIVING THE BUILDING.
UH, MR. KESSLER GENEROUSLY OFFERED TO PAY FOR THE RELOCATION OF THE STRUCTURE AS WELL AS TO PUT A NEW FOUNDATION FOR THE STRUCTURE TO SIT ON, BECAUSE AS YOU'LL HAVE READ IN THE ENGINEER AND REPORTS, THE STRUCTURE
[01:10:01]
IS, UH, TERMITE DAMAGED AND IS IN VERY, VERY POOR CONDITION.SO THAT WAS THE PROCESS THAT WE WENT THROUGH, UM, TO DETERMINE ALL THE DIFFERENT OPTIONS.
UM, WE'RE OPEN, YOU KNOW, THE APPLICATION ALLOWS FOR BOTH DEMOLITION AND RELOCATION, UH, THE APPLICATION THAT WE SUBMITTED.
SO WE'RE OPEN TO EITHER OF THOSE AND REALLY WOULD LOVE TO, UM, HEAR ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU MAY HAVE ON THE PROCESS THAT WE WENT THROUGH, SOME OF THE DISCOVERIES WE HAD OR ANYTHING ELSE THAT I CAN HELP ANSWER I HAD MY DAY.
WELL, I'M NOT SURE WHAT IT WAS, BUT I'M GLAD YOU'RE OPEN TO MOVING IT.
I'M GLAD YOU COULD INTRODUCE MYSELF AND WHAT ROLE YOU'RE PLAYING.
MY NAME IS CHRISTIAN, SO TEAL, UM, AND TOWN PLANNER AND ARCHITECT, AND AN EDUCATOR.
AND I'VE BEEN WORKING WITH THE KESSLER COLLECTION, UH, ON ANALYZING THIS PROPERTY.
AND, AND I UNDERSTAND YOU WERE INVOLVED IN THIS PART OF OUR PROCESS THAT WE WROTE THE TOWN HISTORIC.
IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT.
IN FACT, I'VE, I'VE COME TO KNOW BLUFFTON OVER MANY YEARS.
IN FACT, NEARLY 25 YEARS AGO, I SPENT A YEAR AND A HALF IN BLUFFTON ON MAY RIVER ROAD THEN LATER ON, UH, BACK IN 2002.
SO ROUGHLY 15 YEARS AGO WAS INVOLVED IN CO-AUTHORING THE FIRST, UH, PRESERVATION MANUAL FOR BLUFFTON.
AND THEN BACK IN 2006, WORK WITH THE, THE DOVER COLON PARTNERS TEAM THAT WORKED ON THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN AND WAS VERY INTEGRAL TO THAT PROCESS.
SO, UM, WE OBVIOUSLY WE BELIEVE STRONGLY IN THE MASTER PLAN AND, AND TO SPEAK TO THE IMPORTANCE OF THE CORNER.
I THAT'S REALLY WHERE I THINK MY COMMENTS TONIGHT ARE REALLY TO, TO REMARK ON THIS PROJECT AS A TOWN PLANNER, UM, REALLY LOOKING AT THE GREATER WHOLE OF BLUFFTON BLUFFTON IN THE PAST, THE BLUFFTON OF TODAY THAT WE MAKE DECISIONS ABOUT AND THE BLUFFTON OF THE FUTURE.
UM, SO CLEARLY, YOU KNOW, THE BLUFFTON STANDS OUT AS A PLACE THAT WE W WE LOVE BECAUSE IT'S SO AUTHENTIC AND IT IS NOT A CONTRIVED PLACE.
IT'S NOT AN IMAGINARY STORY BOOK PLACE OF A PASTIME, BUT IT IS A REAL PLACE AND REAL PLACES MAKE DECISIONS AND REAL PLACES CAN AND SHOULD EVOLVE, BUT ABOVE ALL BEING AUTHENTIC.
AND I REALLY COULD THINK OF NO BETTER SITE IN BLUFFTON TO EXTEND THE HUMAN SCALE AND THE PEDESTRIAN QUALITIES THAT MAKE IT SUCH A GREAT PLACE.
UM, AND IT, AND IT'S GROUNDED FROM, YOU KNOW, MANY YEARS OF THINKING ABOUT BLUFFTON AND HAVING THE OPPORTUNITY TO WORK IN BLUFFTON.
UM, AND REALLY IT'S, IT'S THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THIS SITE AS ONE OF THE FOUR CORNERS OF BLUFFTON IS IT IS ONE OF THE FOUR CORNERS OF BLUFFTON.
IT'S A SITE WITH REALLY WITHOUT PRECEDENT.
AND IT'S A SITE THAT HAS CIVIC RESPONSIBILITY, AND THAT'S EXACTLY WHY THE TOWN HALL WAS SHOWN ON THIS SITE DURING THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN.
SO NEEDLESS TO SAY, WE'RE VERY EXCITED TO BE A PART OF THE CONVERSATION, AND WE'RE HONORED TO BE A PART OF THE CONVERSATION.
AND WE SEE IT REALLY IS A, IT'S A, IT'S A BROADER CONTEXT, UH, DECISION HERE.
UM, IS IT A PRESERVATION PROJECT? ABSOLUTELY.
IT'S PRESERVING BLUFFTON ITS FUTURE.
SO I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS, BUT I WANT IT TO SAY MY, MY ROLE IN THE PROJECT AND, AND PERSPECTIVE ON IT.
SO THANK YOU FOR THE COMMENTS FROM THE APPLICANT.
SO I GUESS OUR NEXT STEP WOULD BE IF, UH, UH, THAI, UH, IN THE FAMILY, UH, DO WE WANT TO BRING THEM UP INDIVIDUALLY OR HOW, HOW DO YOU WANT TO THE FAMILY? HOW WOULD YOU LIKE TO DO THE PRESENTATION OR TALK? WHAT, WHAT'S YOUR, I GUESS YOU KIND OF HAVE A, MORE OF AN OPEN DOOR OPPORTUNITY.
SO, UM, TY, IF YOU WANT TO BE KIND OF THE DIRECTOR OF THAT, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S A ROLE YOU WANT TO TAKE, BUT, UH, KIND OF, I THINK IF YOU WILL, I THINK IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE TO HAVE, UM, JOINEE, UH, I'M SORRY, UH, TO HAVE ERNIE SINGLETON, MRS. SINGLETON'S DAUGHTER TO SPEAK.
AND, UM, I THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT EVERYONE HEARS CLEARLY WHAT SHE'S GONNA SAY.
I THINK IT'S VERY, VERY, VERY IMPACTFUL.
SO I WANT TO HAVE VERNIE SINGLETON COME UP.
MY MOTHER IS DOROTHY JORDAN SINGLETON, THE 92 YEAR OLD LAST LIVING DIRECT AIR OF BESSIE JOINER, WHO ALONG WITH HER HUSBAND, BERTRAM RAISED 11 CHILDREN
[01:15:01]
AT 2 0 9 BLUFFTON ROAD REMEMBERED BY MY MOM IS 1 32 HAPPY STREET.WHEN SHE LAST RESIDED THERE IN 1952, THIS MEETING TODAY IS ABOUT DEMOLISHING THE FAMILY HOME THERE, WHICH I REMEMBER FINALLY, ESPECIALLY ROCKING ON THE GREEN WOODEN SWING, STILL ON THE FRONT PORCH FACING BRUIN ROAD.
I LOVE OLD THINGS TO OLD STORIES, OLD PEOPLE, OLD FURNITURE, BUT MY ATTACHMENT TO OLD THINGS, DWINDLES WHEN REALITY OVERRIDES THE PHYSICAL MEMORIES, FADE PEOPLE DIE, THINGS FALL APART, BUT LIFE GOES ON.
THANK GOD OLD BUILDINGS SHOULD HAVE A PLACE IN A COMMUNITY.
THOSE SURROUNDING WALLS HAVE HEARD AND SEEN IT ALL WITHIN ITS FABRIC.
NO MATTER HOW TATTERED LINGERS THE BREATH AND VOICE OF THOSE WHO PROUDLY WALKED THE FLOORS THAT NOW SAG BELOW A DECAYING ROOF.
I UNDERSTAND THE RESPECT THAT SOME OF YOU HAVE FOR THIS OLD HOUSE THAT HAS BEEN BURNED AND REMODELED.
HONESTLY, IT'S ALL YOU HAVE TO CONNECT YOURSELVES TO A TIME WAY OF LIFE AND COMMUNITY.
YOU LONG TO KNOW MORE ABOUT AND SHARE WITH OTHERS.
FOR THOSE WHO DON'T KNOW PERSONALLY, MEMBERS OF THE JOINT OF FAMILY, THE HOUSE IS ALL YOU HAVE.
KESSLER WANTS TO BRING THAT NARRATIVE TO LIFE WITH THEIR HOTEL PLANS, TO INCLUDE HISTORICAL VIDEOS, PHOTOGRAPHS, JOIN A FAMILY AND COMMUNITY ORAL HISTORIES, GALA ART PERIOD ARTIFACTS, GULLAH CUISINE, AND ACTIVITIES LIKE LOW COUNTRY.
OYSTER ROSE SOUNDS BETTER THAN A MUSEUM.
IT WILL BE A LIVING LEGACY TO GULLAH CULTURE AND TO THE OLD TOWN, BLUFFTON COMMUNITY AND WAY OF LIFE.
HOWEVER, OUR RESTORED BUILDING STANDING ALONE FOR THE SAKE OF PRESERVATION CANNOT TELL ITS OWN STORY.
GIVE THE HOUSE A CHANCE TO CONTINUE DEVELOPING UNDER THE UMBRELLA OF A COMMUNITY EFFORT.
KESSLER HAS AGREED TO DO THIS.
I HEARD SOME TOWN OFFICIALS DISCUSSING THE HOUSE LATER.
I FIGURED OUT WHY HEARING FIXES THIS EXCHANGE MADE ME FEEL SO UNCOMFORTABLE, SO THREATENED AS THEY DISCUSSED HER BRICKS, HER WINDOWS AND LIGHT FIXTURES.
AS THOUGH IT WAS ME, THEY WERE EXAMINING AS I STOOD ON A SLAVE AUCTION BLOCK, DON'T LET THIS HOUSE BE AN OBJECT TO BE MANIPULATED, TO SERVE A PERSONAL POLITICAL OR PROFESSIONAL AGENDA.
EXCEPTIONS HAVE BEEN MADE TO DEMOLISH CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES IN BLUFFTON.
WHY NOT THIS CASE? THE KESSLER PROJECT DESERVES THAT ALLOWANCE AND MORE BECAUSE OF ITS PROJECTED BENEFITS TO THE ENTIRE LOW COUNTRY COMMUNITY.
DON'T PUNISH THE JOINT OF FAMILY FOR DECISIONS MADE IN THE PAST, MS. HAYWARD, YOU ARE RIGHT.
PRESERVATION IS ECONOMIC GAIN, BUT FOR WHOM, APPARENTLY NOT FOR THE JOINT OF FAMILY, YOU TELL ME WHO WILL GAIN IF THE FAMILY, IF THE JOINT OF FAMILY WHO HAS NURTURED THIS PROPERTY AND PAID LAND TAXES FOR NEARLY 150 YEARS CAN SAY, TIME IS UP GOODBYE TO THIS HOUSE THAN A STRANGER SHOULD AS WELL.
IT SHOULD BE THE SOLE RIGHT AND PRIVILEGE OF THE PROPERTY OWNER TO DETERMINE THE FATE OF THEIR PERSONAL PROPERTY, WHETHER THEY HAVE THE WILL AND MEANS TO RESTORE OR TO DEMOLISH IT, PLEASE SHOW SOME RESPECT FOR THE PROPERTY OWNER.
UM, AND YOU LIKE TO INTRODUCE, I GUESS I'M KIND OF ASKING YOU TO BE THE LEAD ON THAT.
THIS IS ALSO, THIS IS ACTUALLY A NIECE AND I'M GOING TO LET HER INTRODUCE HERSELF.
MY FATHER WAS ONE OF THE SONS OF BESSIE AND BERTRAM JOINER.
I HAVE FOND MEMORIES IN THIS HOUSE, BUT I HAVE FOND STORIES ALSO.
SO FIRST OF ALL, I NEED TO KNOW CLEARLY WHAT IS HISTORICAL ABOUT THIS PIECE OF PROPERTY? THERE IS A PIECE OF PIECE OF THE HOUSE IN THE MIDDLE THAT WAS IN THE THIRTIES, MY FATHER, AND A COUPLE OF HIS BROTHERS RE UH, BUILT PART OF THAT HOUSE.
WHEN THEY CAME HOME FROM THE WAR IN, IN WORLD WAR TWO IN THE FORTIES, AND THEN YOU HAVE THE BACK END OF THE HOUSE.
SO YOU'VE GOT THREE DIFFERENT AREAS SITTING ON THIS PIECE OF PROPERTY.
WHAT IS HISTORICAL? AND THEN YOU HAVE THIS SHIT, THE, THE, UM, THE BARBECUE PIT THAT WAS BUILT IN THE SEVENTIES.
SO THERE IS, YOU'VE GOT THREE DIFFERENT
[01:20:01]
AREAS, THREE DIFFERENT THINGS MADE BY THREE DIFFERENT PEOPLE.AND SO I TO KNOW, AND I NEED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT IS HISTORICAL AND LIKE MY ANDAR SAYS, IF WE CAN GET RID OF IT AND WE CAN SAY, TIME IS UP, LET IT GO.
I HAVE FOND MEMORIES OF GOING OUT IN THE BACKYARD, PUMPING WATER OUT OF THE PUMP, GETTING MOST, ALL OF THE TREE AND COOKING WITH A POT OUT OF THE KITCHEN.
CAN'T THIS IS A DISGRACE TO US BECAUSE IT IS DONE.
THERE'S NOTHING HERE TO SALVAGE.
THERE'S NOTHING HERE TO SAY THAT I REMEMBER BEING ON THIS PROPERTY.
WHEN YOU STEPPED TO THE PODIUM, IF YOU COULD INTRODUCE YOURSELF, PLEASE.
GOOD EVENING COMMISSIONER AND EVERYONE PRESENT.
SO WE'RE ARE, I GUESS, FIRST, SECOND GENERATION.
UM, WE LIKE SHE'S EXPRESSED, WE HAVE FOND MEMORIES OF BLUFFTON.
IF ANYONE HERE WAS, WE CALL IT BACK IN THE DAY.
WHEN YOU WILL LOOK FOR BLUFFTON, IT WAS A LITTLE SPOT LIKE THIS ON THE MAP THAT HAS NOW TURNED INTO A COSMOPOLITAN TOWN, UM, WHICH WE ARE ALL PROUD OF.
WE COME BACK EVERY YEAR, EVERY TWO YEARS, WE HAVE FAMILY REUNIONS, BUT AS I SAID, UM, WE'RE WORKING WITH LIKE TO WORK WITH THE KESSLER RESTORE AND KEEP THE FOND MEMORIES OF OLD TOWN BLUFFTON, BECAUSE LIKE YOU, WE LIKE TO SEE THE OLD AND THE NEW, BUT WE DO NOT WANT TO BE PENALIZE BECAUSE THE BLUFFTON, THE JOINER HOME WAS JUST A FAMILY HOME.
IT WAS NOT A HISTORICAL SITE OF ANY VISITATION OR COMMUNITY EVENTS OF SUCH THAT MOST, UM, HISTORICAL, UH, BUILDINGS WOULD BE WHERE YOU WOULD GO IN AND TOUR.
I BET YOU, YOU COULD NOT WALK IN THE DOOR OF 1 20, 1 32, 1 22 EAST HAPPY STREET, 2 0 9 1 ROAD OR NINE ONE ROAD AS IT IS TODAY.
SO WE WILL LIKE TO WORK WITH THE KESSLER, HAD THE TOWN APPROVE TO PRESERVE IT IN WHATEVER WAY IT CAN, BUT IT NEEDS NOT TO STAY IN THE CURRENT CONDITION BECAUSE IT IS, UM, AS THE CONSTRUCTION ENGINEERS HAVE PROVEN THAT IT IS VERY DANGEROUS.
AND GOING BACK TO 2006, I REMEMBER WHEN THEY WERE MARKING OLD TOWN WHERE THEIR SITE IS FOR NEW TOWN HALL.
SO WHEN THIS CAME TO US THAT IT WAS, UM, HISTORICAL AND THAT IT COULDN'T BE THE MORE POLISHED.
UM, WE WERE TAKEN BACK BY THAT, UM, BECAUSE IT IS OUR PROPERTY AND WE SHOULD, AND WE BID THAT WE CAN DO AND REAP THE BENEFITS SOLD BY OUR FOREFATHERS ON THAT PROPERTY AND THE TAXES THAT WE HAVE INCURRED AND PAID OVER THE YEARS.
UM, TAIWAN SCOTT, I'M HERE ACTUALLY AS A CO-APPLICANT AGENT FOR THE FAMILY, BUT MORE SO IN THE CAPACITY AS THE LOCAL PRESIDENT OF THE NATIONAL ACTION NETWORK.
AND I WANT TO FIRST START OFF BY SAYING, UM, YOU KNOW, I HAVE A LETTER HERE THAT EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE ALREADY BEEN PRIVY TO, UH, COMING FROM THE SOUTH CAROLINA DEPARTMENT OF ARCHIVES AND HISTORY, UM, SHOWING IN BASICALLY SAYING THAT THIS PROPERTY IS OUTSIDE OF THEIR LISTED BOUNDARIES, AS FAR AS THE NATIONAL REGISTRY OF HISTORIC PLACES IS CONCERNED SO THAT YOU GUYS SHOULD HAVE ALREADY BEEN MADE PRIVILEGED TO THAT.
SO WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS A LOCAL ORDINANCE, THAT NATIONAL ORDINANCE.
[01:25:01]
COULD YOU REPEAT THAT ONE MORE TIME? YES.THE, THE LETTER COMING, COMING FROM ELIZABETH JOHNSON DATED, UM, MAY 15TH, 2020 IS BASICALLY STATING THAT THIS PROPERTY LOCATED AT NINE BRUIN ROAD OR 2 0 9 BLUFFTON ROAD AS SHOWN IS LISTED OUTSIDE OF THE NATIONAL REGISTRY OF HISTORIC PLACES.
SO IT'S NOT WITHIN THE NATIONAL REGISTRY.
IT'S THE TOWN OF BLUFFTON LOCAL BOUNDARY THAT HAS DEDICATED THIS PROPERTY.
I JUST WROTE THAT THAT'S THE NATIONAL REGISTER DIRECTOR, ELIZABETH JOHNS, ELIZABETH JOHNSON, THE DIRECTOR OF HISTORICAL SERVICES.
THANK YOU, UH, CRITERIA THAT I DID NOT HEAR MENTIONED, BUT KEEPS COMING UP, UM, THAT THE TOWN HAS ESTABLISHED.
THE CLASSIFIED STRUCTURES AS CONTRIBUTING IS ONLY IS, IS THAT IT HAS BEEN IN EXISTENCE FOR 50 YEARS.
THIS CODE IS TO THE NATIVE GULLAH FAMILIES IN REGARDS TO ECONOMIC SUSTAINABLE OPPORTUNITIES.
AND IT MUST BE REVISED AFFORDING BLUFFTON, GULEN, NATIVES, SUSTAINABLE ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITIES MUST BE MORE THAN LIP SERVICE.
THE TOWN OF BLUFFTON MUST ELEVATE AND INCORPORATE SUSTAINABLE, EQUITABLE OPPORTUNITIES FOR GALA CITIZENS AS A MAJOR PRIORITY AND INITIATIVE INTO ITS ANNUAL GOALS.
THE JOIN A FAMILY IS FORMALLY REQUESTED FOR THIS COMMISSION TO USE WHATEVER CRITERIA THEY HAVE PREVIOUSLY USED AND ALLOW THE DEMO OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES FROM THEIR PROPERTY, OR IF AVAILABLE TO UNANIMOUSLY APPROVE THE REMOVAL OF THE STRUCTURE STRUCTURES FROM THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE LIST.
THE HPC HAS ALREADY ALLOWED MULTIPLE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES THROUGHOUT THE HISTORIC DISTRICT TO BE DEMOED.
RESIDENTS HAS ALREADY BEEN ESTABLISHED BY THIS COMMISSION.
I WANT TO REFERENCE THE MES SIX BUILDING AND THE GUCCIO PROPERTIES.
THE DIFFERENCE WE HAVE BEFORE US TODAY IS THAT A DEVELOPER IS WILLING TO HIGHLIGHT A NATIVE GALA'S FAMILY HISTORY AND CULTURE.
THIS IS MORE THAN A TOWN HAS DONE THEMSELVES.
THE TOWN HAS ALLOWED STRUCTURES TO BE DEMOED FOR YEARS.
JUST TAKE A LOOK AT THE AMOUNT OF DELTA DEVELOPMENT, WHICH HAS TAKEN PLACE AROUND BLUFFTON AND OTHER THAN FINDING A NATIVE GIRL, HIS FAMILY'S NAME ON THE TAX RECORDS, THERE'S NO REFERENCE OF FORMERLY OWNED GULLAH PROPERTY.
TESLA'S GULLAH THEME BOUTIQUE WILL BE A FIRST OF ITS KIND AND WILL ELEVATE A CULTURE.
WHAT'S BEEN MUCH BETTER THAN OLD DILAPIDATED HOUSE, WHICH SAYS NOTHING.
THE PUBLIC CITIZENS WILL BE ABLE TO FEEL, SEE, HEAR, AND EXPERIENCE A WAY OF LIFE THROUGH THE KESSLER DEVELOPMENT.
THE HOME IS A LIABILITY FOR THE JOINT OF FAMILY AND THE FACT THAT THEY HAVE BEEN PRESENTED WITH AN OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE A VOICE IN THIS POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT IS AN HONOR TO THEM AND THE GULLAH CULTURE IN ITSELF.
AT LEAST THE STORY WILL BE TOLD, AT LEAST THE STORY WHICH WILL BE TOLD WILL AUTHENTIC AND NOT SOMEONE'S WATER DOWN VERSION OF A GULLAH FAMILY'S HISTORY AND CULTURE KESSLER HAS ALSO COMMITTED TO INCLUDING BUILDING FEATURES AND MATERIALS INTO THE DEVELOPMENT IN ORDER TO HIGHLIGHT CERTAIN AREAS OF HISTORY OF ALL THE PERSEVERATION IS GROUPS CONTACTED BY THE TOWN, ONLY ONE EXPRESS CONCERNS AND WERE TO PROVIDE AN OPINION.
HOWEVER, NO FORMAL OPINION WAS UPDATED INTO THE PUBLIC'S PACKAGE.
SPECIFICALLY, ALL OF THE GULLET THEMED ORGANIZATIONS DID NOT OBJECT TO THE DEMOLITION OF THE STRUCTURE TO ADD ALL OF THE GOVERNMENT ENTITIES, WHICH ARE REQUIRED TO RESPOND EITHER SUPPORT OR SUPPORT WITH CONDITIONS.
THE DEMOLITION OF THE STRUCTURES,
[01:30:02]
IT'S ONLY A MEMBER OF THE HPRC BOARD THAT RECOMMENDS RELOCATION VERSUS DEMO.THE TOWN OF BLUFFTON THEMSELVES HAD ONE SLATED THIS PARCEL OF LAND FOR ITS TOWN CENTER, WHICH IN WHICH THE RENDERINGS CLEARLY SHOWED STRUCTURES REMOVED FROM THE PROPERTY.
IT'S OBVIOUS THAT A GULLAH THEME DEVELOPMENT IS TOTALLY SUPPORTED BY ORGANIZATIONS WHOSE PRIMARY FOCUS IS PRESERVING HISTORY AND CULTURE.
AGAIN, THIS DEVELOPMENT WILL BE THE FIRST OF ITS KIND AND CAN TRULY BE AN ASSET TO THE TOWN OF BLUFFTON HISTORICAL DESTINATION, BY OPINION, A DEVELOPMENT SUCH AS KESSLER'S GULLAH THEMED BOUTIQUE HOTEL WILL EASILY GRAB THE ATTENTION OF THE SOUTH CAROLINA DEPARTMENT OF ARCHIVES AND HISTORY, THE GULLAH GEECHEE, CURT CULTURE, HERITAGE CORRIDOR COMMISSION, AND COUNTLESS OTHER ORGANIZATIONS WHOSE PRIMARY FOCUS IS HISTORY AND CULTURE.
FAMILY IS REQUESTING THIS BOARD SUPPORT FOR DEMOLITION OF THE STRUCTURES OR ITS REMOVAL FROM THE LIST SO THAT A NEW ERA OF HISTORY, WHICH CONTINUES TO BE NEGLECTED AND BE HONORED, HIGHLIGHTED, AND ELEVATED TO THE STATUTE IN WHICH IT RIGHTFULLY DESERVES.
AND I, I WANT TO MAKE THIS AVAILABLE.
THIS IS THE LETTER THAT MS. SINGLETON, UH, SUBMITTED TO THE, TO THE TOWN TO YOU GUYS.
AND IF, IF I'M SORRY, CAN WE DO THAT? UM, I WANT TO MAKE IT AVAILABLE.
WHAT I WANT TO READ IT INTO THE RECORD.
IF THAT'S FINE, WE HAVE SOMETHING ADDED TO THE MINUTES OR HOW, HOW WHAT'S THE BEST APPROACH TO DO THIS CORRECTLY.
SO WE CAN GIVE IT TO DARBY WHO CAN INCORPORATE IT INTO THE MINUTES AFTER THE FACT, ANYTHING THAT IS BROUGHT BEFORE THE COMMISSION THAT NEEDS TO BE, THAT'S GOING TO WEIGH ON Y'ALL'S DECISION-MAKING HERE.
UH, IT NEEDS TO BE INCORPORATED INTO THE OFFICIAL OFFICIAL PACKAGE.
SO FOR THE RECORD IT IS, AND IT'S IN THE PACKAGE.
SO I THINK WE FIND WITHIN THE PACKAGES, THE LETTER THAT, YES, THE RESPECT I'M GOING TO CALL VERNIE SINGLETON BACK UP AND ASK HER TO READ HER MOTHER'S LETTER.
AND THIS IS YOUR MOTHER, CORRECT? YES.
UH, I AM 92 YEARS OLD AND I'M PROUD TO BE THE LAST OF 11 CHILDREN ALL TO HAVE BEEN BORN IN THE HOUSE AT TWO OH NINE BLUFFTON ROAD, MY SIBLINGS, THEIR CHILDREN, AND GRANTS, AND SOME GRAND SLEPT IN THE BEDS, ROCKED ON THE PORCH, WALKED THE HALL AND PLAYED HIDE AND GO SEEK UNTIL DARK.
THAT PART OF OUR FAMILY'S LIFE HAS BEEN OVER FOR YEARS.
THE HOUSE IS ABANDONED AND NO FAMILY MEMBER PLANS TO OCCUPY IT.
THE HOUSE HAS SERVED ITS PURPOSE.
IT DOES NOT MATTER TO ME WHETHER THE HOUSE IS DEMOLISHED OR TOWED AWAY TO ANOTHER LOCATION.
WHAT DOES MATTER IS THAT IT BE REMOVED IN ORDER THAT A NEW ERA AND OLD TOWN BLUFFTON CAN TAKE ROOT AND FLOURISH LIKE THE OLD OAKS THAT GRACED ITS GROUNDS, LET THE KESSLER GROUP WITH THEIR OWN STYLE OF RESPECT AND ENTHUSIASM FOR LOCAL CULTURE, HAVE THEIR WAY WITH THE PROPERTY TO IMPLEMENT THEIR PLANS FOR SHOWCASING COMMUNITY GULLAH CULTURE AND THE JOURNAL LEGACY.
IT IS MY DESIRE TO SEE THE PROPERTY SOLD WITHIN MY LIFETIME.
AND FROM WHAT I CAN TELL THE KESSLER PLANS MORE THAN SATISFYING MY HOPES FOR ITS CONTINUED LONGEVITY AS A GIFT AND TRIBUTE TO MY HOMETOWN AND FAMILY.
THANK YOU, DOROTHY, JOIN A SINGLETON.
THIS IS, THIS IS BEFORE THE COMMISSION AND IT IS A MATTER OF A PUBLIC HEARING.
SO PRIOR JUST THE PROCEDURE FOR PUBLIC HEARING, UH, WHAT WE WOULD REQUEST THAT YOU DO IS MAKE A MOTION TO GO, UH, TO OPEN PUBLIC HEARING, GET A SECOND VOTE, OPEN UP PUBLIC HEARING, AND THEN AFTERWARDS, A MOTION TO CLOSE PUBLIC HEARING.
ONCE ALL PUBLIC COMMENT IS EXHAUSTED.
THAT'S JUST A, IT'S A FORMALITY FOR MANNY.
SO WE DO HAVE TWO, UM, PUBLIC, UH, PUBLICS THAT WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK.
SO I GUESS I NEED TO GET A MOTION FOR OPENING
[01:35:01]
FOR A PUBLIC HEARING OR PUBLIC COMMENTS, MOTION TO OPEN UP THIS MATTER FOR PUBLIC HEARING.I MAKE A MOTION TO OPEN UP THIS MATTER FOR PUBLIC HEALTH.
THE MOTION BACK IN THE MOTION.
UH, CAN I GET A VOTE ON THAT ALL IN FAVOR? AYE.
ANY OPPOSED? SO WE ARE OPEN AND I HAVE ONE, UH, JOANIE HAYWARD.
IF YOU COULD APPROACH THE PODIUM, INTRODUCE YOURSELF AND WHERE YOU LIVE, PLEASE.
AND DARBY IS, I AM JEREMY HAYWARD AND I LIVE AT 95 BOUNDARY STREET AND OLD TOWN.
MR. CHAIR AND MEMBERS OF THE HPC.
I APPRECIATE THIS OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK FIRST.
LET ME BE CLEAR AS I HAVE BEFORE I AM IN NO WAY, A POSE TO THE CASTLE, BUILDING A BOUTIQUE MOTEL HOTEL WITH A GULLAH THEME.
HOWEVER, I AM OPPOSED TO DEMOLITION OF ANY OF OUR, UH, CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES.
THIS IS A HUGE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE JOIN OF FAMILY.
IT'S A HUGE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE KESSLER CORPORATION.
IT'S A BIG OPPORTUNITY FOR BLUFFTON.
Y'ALL NEED TO MAKE IT A BIG OPPORTUNITY FOR PRESERVATION.
IN THE MID TO EARLY IN THE EARLY TO MID 20TH CENTURY, BLUFFTON WAS REDEVELOPING.
MANY AFRICAN-AMERICAN FAMILIES BUILT THEIR HOMES ALONG MAY RIVER ROAD AND THE COTTAGE STYLE ARCHITECTURE.
THE COTTAGE ARCHITECTURE CAME FROM EUROPE THROUGH THE WEST END DAYS TO AMERICA.
AND TO BLUFFTON, THIS HISTORY CAME FROM SCAB PROFESSOR DR.
DAVES ROZELLE AS THE LE AT A LECTURE HE GAVE HIM LEFT IN TWO OR THREE YEARS AGO.
WE HAVE ONLY A FEW HOMES LEFT FROM THIS ERA.
KIKI CLEVELAND RECENTLY BECAME THE OWNER OF ONE WATCH STREET.
SHE IS THE FOURTH GENERATION TO OWN THAT HOME AND SHE WANTS TO REHABILITATE IT.
ONE OF HER ANCESTORS, THE DANIEL BROWN'S HOME IS NEXT TO THE POLICE PRECINCT.
WE SAVED THAT AS YOU ARE AWARE, WE SAVED THAT HOME FROM DEMOLITION DOWN THE ROAD A LITTLE BIT AS MR. BRUINS HOME ACROSS THE STREET THAT'S SURVIVING.
AND THEN IF WE GO TO CALHOUN AND MAY RIVER ROAD, THERE'S THAT HOUSE THAT WE ALL KNOW THAT PRECIOUS YELLOW HOUSE HAS BEEN THERE ALONG WITH ITS NEXT DOOR NEIGHBOR.
AND THEN WE GO ACROSS THE STREET TO THE JOINER COTTAGE.
NO, IT'S PROBABLY NOT A HUGE ARCHITECTURAL FEAT, BUT IT TELLS A STORY OF BLUFFTON.
IT TELLS HOW AFRICAN-AMERICANS BUILT THEIR OWN FAMILY HOMES ALONG THE MAY RIVER ROAD.
I AM ON MONDAY AND TUESDAY, CHRISTIAN.
SO TILL AND WE'LL ACT AND HAVE BEEN IN TOUCH WITH ME CONCERNING THE PROGRESS OF FINDING A NEW LOCATION AND A NEW OWNER FOR THE JOIN, THE HOME THEY HAVE BEEN SUCCESSFUL.
AS YOU KNOW, IT TAKES A NEW OWNER ALONG A FEW LONGER THAN THREE DAYS TO DO THEIR DUE DILIGENCE.
THREE DAYS IS NOT ENOUGH TIME IN LIGHT OF THIS THREE MINUTES, THREE MINUTES.
WELL, YEAH, I WOULD LIKE TO FINISH IF I'M THERE IN LIGHT OF THIS, UM, AND ITEM ON YOUR AGENDA, I WOULD SUGGEST THAT WE TABLE THIS OFF OF THE KESSLER UNTIL THE KESSLER GROUP HAS A CONTRACT IN HAND WITH A NEW LOCATION AND A NEW OWNER PRESSURE IS HEALTHY AND GETS THINGS DONE.
IT IS MY SINCERE BELIEF THAT THE CASTLE GROUP WILL WITHIN A REASONABLE TIME BE BACK TO YOU SO YOU CAN APPROVE RELOCATION.
AND I REALLY WANT TO TAKE THIS OPPORTUNITY TO COMMEND AND THE KESSLER GROUP WILL AND CHRISTIAN FROM MOVING TO DEMOLITION TO RELOCATION, THEY'VE DONE IT.
THIS DEMONSTRATES THEIR RESPECT AND UNDERSTANDING OF THE IMPORTANCE OF BLUFFTON HISTORY AND THEIR RECOGNITION OF THE IMPORTANCE OF PRESERVATION AND BLUFFTON.
AND AS YOU KNOW, OUR OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN SAYS THE TOWN STRIVES TO ACHIEVE ECONOMIC VITALITY THROUGH DEVELOPMENT AND REDEVELOPMENT WHILE ENSURING THAT BLUFFED INS COMMUNITY CHARACTER AND HISTORICAL HERITAGE ARE PRESERVED.
[01:40:01]
CONFIDENCE THAT YEAR, THE MEMBERS OF THE HPC ARE STRIVING TO ENSURE OUR CHARACTER AND OUR HISTORICAL HERITAGE.AND THANK YOU FOR THE EXTRA MINUTE.
AND MR. CHAIRMAN JUST WROTE JUST FOR THE RECORD, IT'S REALLY UP, IT'S UP TO YOU.
AND IT'S UP TO THE COMMISSION AS TO WHETHER TO ALLOW SOMEONE TO GO OVER THREE MINUTES, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S A MATTER OF PUBLIC HEARING.
A LITTLE BIT MORE LEEWAY IS OFTEN GIVEN.
SO WE TRY TO LIMIT IT TO THREE MINUTES, BUT SO WE DON'T RAN RAMBLE ON TWO, 10 AND 15, SO YOU STILL WANT TO PRESS IT AND WE HAVE TO BE COGNIZANT OF, UM, IN THE FUTURE.
UH, SO WE ARE STILL GONNA TRY TO MAINTAIN THREE MINUTES.
SO IF YOU CAN, UH, W WE HAVE ANOTHER INDIVIDUAL SHARON BROWN, YOU DO GET THREE MINUTES.
AND IF YOU CAN COME TO THE PODIUM AND YOU'RE ABLE TO TAKE, I THINK YOU CAN TAKE FEAR.
I BELIEVE AS YOU'RE TALKING TO ME, IS THAT INAPPROPRIATE, AND THEN YOU COULD STATE YOUR NAME AND WHERE YOU LIVE, PLEASE.
MY NAME IS SHARON BROWN AND MY ADDRESS ON THERE IS 25 BOUNDARY STREET.
THANK YOU SO MUCH, MR. CHAIRMAN.
SO I, EVERYBODY HAS SAID, YOU KNOW WHAT THEY NEEDED TO SAY, BUT THIS IS SOMETHING SO IMPORTANT.
AND I, MS. JOANIE, HAYWOOD, GOD BLESS HER, YOU KNOW, PRESERVATION AND ALL OF THAT.
BUT WHEN YOU GUYS, IF YOU'RE NOT FROM BUFFET AND YOU LOOK BACK BLUFFTON, THERE IS NO MORE BLUFFTON WITH THE AFRICAN-AMERICANS IN THEIR HOME, IN THE STRUCTURE.
YOU GOT THESE TWO STORY, MONSTER BUILDINGS, SO THAT ALL THAT'S GONE TOO.
SO THE PRESERVATION BART, I GET IT.
PLEASE LET THE JOIN A FAMILY HOUSE, GO.
IF THEY'RE GOING TO RELOCATE IT, I'LL TELL YOU A GOOD PLACE TO RELOCATE THE GUYS.
YOU THINK ABOUT IT, MOVE IT WHERE THE GAVI HOUSES PUT IT RIGHT THERE ON THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY.
Y'ALL ASK THEM, CAN YOU DO THAT? OKAY.
BECAUSE SOMETHING HAS TO GIVE IT'S WE, AS AFRICAN-AMERICANS HAVE TO STOP COMING BAGGING.
THAT'S WHAT THESE PEOPLE ARE PRACTICALLY DOING BEGGING FOR YOU GUYS TO ALLOT THEM, TO USE THAT FAMILY HOME, TO DEMOLISH IT OR MOVE IT.
BUT, UH, TYLER WAS TALKING ABOUT THAT WAS 2008.
YOU GUYS SAID YOU UPGRADED OR WHATEVER IT WAS AFTER THAT, WHEN THAT MESSICKS HOUSE, UM, THE GAS STATION WHERE X CENTRICITY WAS, WAS PERMITTED TO BE DEMOLISHED.
SO LET'S STOP US HAVING TO COME HERE BEGGING FOR US TO BE JUST A PART OF THE COMMUNITY RIGHT HERE, AS AFRICAN-AMERICANS WHERE WE KNOW THAT THE BLUFFTON TOWN USED TO BE CALHOUN STREET, YOU ALREADY KNOW IT USED TO BE AFRICAN-AMERICANS THE LADY ON THE CORNER OF THE HOUSE BUILT THERE, WHERE THE CHAMBER IS USED TO BE A BLACK OWNED PROPERTY.
SO IT'S TIME FOR US TO LET'S LIVE AS A COMMUNITY.
THE TOWN MISSION STATEMENT SAYS, WE ALL ARE ONE TOGETHER.
IF YOU GUYS CAN'T DO THE RIGHT THING AND STOP HAVING PEOPLE HAVE TO COME TO TOWN, COUNCIL, MEETING, BEGGING TO UTILIZE THEIR PROPERTY THE WAY THEY SEE FIT.
AND ONE OTHER THING, HOW DO I GET ON THAT PR THIS COMMITTEE RIGHT HERE? BECAUSE WE NEED A LITTLE DIVERSITY.
IT'S APPARENT THAT SOMETHING'S BROKEN.
I APPLIED NOBODY TO CALL ME IN, I GUESS I DON'T HAVE THE DEGREE, BUT JUST KNOW CHAIRMAN BROWN WANTS TO BE ON THE PREHISTORIC COMMITTEE.
THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME.
IT LOOKS LIKE WE HAVE ALL COMMENTS AND WE HAVE DISCUSSION ONE OF THE QUESTIONS I WANT TO ASK.
DID YOU, WOULD YOU, LIKE, I KNOW YOU HAVEN'T SENT IN ONE OF THESE, BUT IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO, OH, YOU'RE A FAMILY MEMBER.
COULD YOU STEP FORWARD PLEASE THEN? YES.
AND IF YOU COULD STATE YOUR NAME.
I AM, UH, SANDRA HEMI'S HUSBAND WHO SPOKE EARLIER.
UM, BASICALLY I'VE LISTENED TO THE, UH, THE COMMENTS PROVIDED BY SOME OF THE, UH, SOME OF THE OTHER SPEAKERS.
AND WHILE I THINK WE CAN ALL AGREE THAT HISTORIC PRESERVATION IS GOOD FOR THE TOWN, THE COMMUNITY, AND AFRICAN-AMERICANS IN GENERAL.
UH, I'D LIKE TO SUGGEST THAT IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, THE PRICE IS BECOMING TOO HIGH, TOO HIGH TO THE JOINER FAMILY FOR THE COST OF MAINTAINING THIS PROPERTY AND THE CURRENT CONDITION THAT IT'S IN.
UM, LET ME SUGGEST ALSO THAT IN ADDITION TO THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION, THAT WE ALSO HAVE THE COMPETING INTERESTS OF THE JOINERS, UH, ECONOMIC VALUE IN THIS PROPERTY,
[01:45:02]
UM, WHILE THE UTO DOES NOT CONSIDER THAT DIMINISHING PROPERTY VALUES AS A JUSTIFICATION FOR APPROVING THE REMOVAL OF A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.UH, I THINK, UM, THE FACT THAT THE ECONOMIC VALUE IS TOTALLY DIMINISHED AND STRIPPED FROM THE FAMILY IS SOMETHING THAT THIS BODY HAS TO CONSIDER.
UM, I THINK IT SHOULD ALSO, I'VE GOT A BOOK HERE CALLED THE LAND WAS OURS.
AND I'D LIKE TO COMMEND IT, YOU KNOW, TO THE BOARD FOR READING, THERE'S A SORTED HISTORY IN THE LOW COUNTRY AREA, UH, PARTICULARLY IN HILTON HEAD IN TERMS OF THE STRIPPING OF ECONOMIC VALUE OF AFRICAN-AMERICANS FROM THEIR PROPERTY.
I THINK WE HAVE TO TAKE THESE KINDS OF THINGS IN CONSIDERATION TO DO EVERYTHING WE CAN TO, UH, ALLOW THE KESSLER GROUP TO USE WHATEVER MEANS THAT IT CAN SO THAT YOU GUYS CAN PROVIDE ASSURANCES TO THE KESSLER GROUP SO THAT WE CAN EITHER REMOVE THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, DEMOLISH THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, OR, UM, ALLOW THE, THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE TO BE MOVED.
SO WE ASK YOU TO CONSIDER THAT, UH, SO THAT THE FAMILY CAN MOVE FORWARD.
AND PLEASE SUPPORT FOR A LITTLE BIT OF CONTEXT WITH OUR CONTRACT, WITH THE JOYNER FAMILY FOR THE PROPERTY.
I THINK IT'S WORTH MENTIONING HOW IMPORTANT IT IS TO ARRIVE AT A DECISION EITHER FOR DEMOLITION OR RELOCATION, BECAUSE THE WAY THAT THE CONTRACTOR'S WRITTEN IS ONCE THE JOYNER FAMILY HAS CLEAR TITLE, THERE'S 30 DAYS OF DUE DILIGENCE AND 15 TO CLOSE, WHICH WOULDN'T PROVIDE US AN, YOU KNOW, IF THEY WERE ABLE TO PROVIDE CLEAN TITLE TOMORROW, IT WOULDN'T GIVE US ENOUGH TIME TO CLOSE ON THE PROPERTY BEFORE THE NEXT HPC MEETING.
WE DON'T KNOW WHEN CLEAN TITLE WILL BE PROVIDED.
THAT'S OUT OF BOTH THE JOINER'S FAMILY'S HANDS AS WELL AS OURS, BUT IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT A DECISION IS MADE, UM, SO THAT IT CAN MOVE FORWARD WITH THE WAY THAT THE CONTRACT IS WRITTEN.
THEY HAVE NOT PRODUCED A CLEAN TITLE AS OF YET THROUGH TITLE RESEARCH, BUT ONCE IT IS THAT'S WHEN THERE'S 30 DAYS.
SO THE SECOND A CLEAR TITLE IS PROVIDED WITHIN 30 DAYS OF THAT MOMENT.
UM, WE HAVE TO BEGIN TO CLOSE ON THE PROPERTY.
SO IF IT WAS PROVIDED TOMORROW, WE, THERE'S NOT ENOUGH TIME FOR HPC TO DELAY AND PAUSE TO ARRIVE AT A DECISION OTHER THAN IF WE KNEW WHEN THE TITLE WAS GOING TO BE CLEAR TO WHICH OF COURSE WE DON'T.
SO IT WAS IMPORTANT THAT A DECISION IS MADE EITHER DEMOLITION OR RELOCATION.
MS. MR. CHAIRMAN, IF I MAY INTERJECT FOR JUST A MOMENT, WE ARE STILL IN THE PUBLIC HEARING PORTION.
WE HAVEN'T MADE A MOTION TO COME TO CLOSE PUBLIC HEARING.
SO I GUESS WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS WE DON'T HAVE ANY OTHER PUBLIC COMMENTS OUT THERE, SO WE NEED TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING PORTION.
I NEED A MOTION ON THAT, PLEASE.
THE PUBLIC HEARING WOULD BE THE SECOND, PLEASE.
ANY DISCUSSION? UH, ALL IN FAVOR.
AND THEN, AND JUST IF I MAY, UM, Y'ALL HEAR ME MORE TONIGHT THAN YOU TYPICALLY DO, BUT WE NEED YOUR GUIDANCE.
WE APPRECIATE IT BECAUSE WE HAVE, UM, I THINK AT LEAST TWO MEMBERS OF THE HPC THAT I'VE NOT HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO, TO MEET BEFORE.
UH, LET ME FIRST INTRODUCE MYSELF.
MY NAME IS RICHARDSON LABRUCE.
I'M AN ATTORNEY WITH FINGER MELANIN BROOKS ON THE BRUISE ON HILTON HEAD AND WE PROVIDE LEGAL SERVICES TO THE TOWN.
I AM I'M HERE FOR THE HISTORIC PLANNING COMMISSION.
SO ANY, ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU MAY HAVE PLEASE FEEL FREE TO ADDRESS THEM TO ME WHEN YOU HAVE A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS APPLICATION, ESPECIALLY ONE FOR THE DEMOLITION OF A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT YOU FOLLOW THE CRITERIA THAT'S OUTLINED IN THE UDA, UM, THAT STAFF AND THE APPLICANT HAVE BOTH TRIED TO ADDRESS AND THEIR NARRATIVES AND IN THEIR REPORTS.
UM, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT YOU MAKE FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW AS TO EACH ONE OF THOSE CRITERIA.
UH, THIS IS AN IMPORTANT APPLICATION AND ON THAT I TRUST THAT YOU ALL WILL FOLLOW THAT CRITERIA, APPLIED TO FACTS THAT YOU'VE HEARD TONIGHT AND RENDER A DECISION ACCORDINGLY.
BUT IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, I'M HERE, IF YOU NEED HELP WITH EMOTION, I'M HERE.
UM, I JUST WANT TO ASK THE APPLICANT, COULD I MENTIONING THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE GOING TO KIND OF CREATE AN AREA FOR PEOPLE TO SEE, IS THIS GOING TO BE OPEN TO THE PUBLIC OR IS THIS JUST GOING TO BE, SO WHEN WE HEAR ALL OF THESE THINGS, I MEAN, HOW, HOW MUCH PUBLIC
[01:50:01]
ABILITIES IS THE PUBLIC GOING TO HAVE? SO THE KESSLER COLLECTIONS PROPERTIES, WE, WE DO TWO THINGS.WE TELL HISTORY AND WE EDUCATE PEOPLE WHEN THEY ARRIVE AND THEY'RE REALLY LIVING MUSEUMS. AND IF YOU GO TO ANY OF OUR PROPERTIES, WHETHER IT'S PLANT RIVERSIDE DISTRICT, WE ALWAYS TELL A STORY.
WE USE, UM, STORIES FROM INDIVIDUALS IN THE PAST.
WE'VE WE USE ART FROM THAT TIME PERIOD.
WE USE MUSIC FROM THAT TIME PERIOD.
WE FIND ARTIFACTS AND IT REALLY BECOMES A LIVING MUSEUM.
UM, AND THE CONCEPT FOR THIS DEVELOPMENT, IT'S A GULLAH THEMED BOUTIQUE HOTEL, WHERE WE HAVE A LOCAL ARTIST AND MARY FERRIS WHO WOULD BE THE ART, UH, HE'S A GOLD NATIVE, AND HE WOULD BE THE ARTIST OF, UM, FOR THE ART THROUGHOUT THE PROJECT.
WE'D LIKE TO INCORPORATE ARTIFACTS, UM, THAT THE COMMUNITY WOULD LIKE TO HAVE PART OF THIS PROJECT THROUGHOUT THE HOTEL LOBBY.
WE'D LIKE TO INCLUDE THE, UH, JOIN OUR FAMILY HISTORY.
AND I'VE SPOKEN WITH, UM, VERNIE ON MANY OCCASIONS AND OTHER MEMBERS OF THE JOINER FAMILY AND HOW CAN WE BEST REPRESENT AND TELL THEIR STORY FROM THEIR A HUNDRED AND PLUS YEARS ON THIS SITE, THROUGH OUR PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT AND FAMILY TREE IN THE HOTEL LOBBY AS PART OF IT, UM, ONE OF THE, UH, I THINK IT WAS VERNIE WHEN WE SPOKE TO ABOUT SIX MONTHS AGO, SHE SAID HER DREAM FOR THIS SITE WAS TO HAVE A GARDEN.
AND COINCIDENTALLY, IN OUR PLANS, WE HAD A COMMUNITY GARDEN RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF IT.
WE WANTED TO REUSE SOME OF THE OLD BRICK FROM THE BARBECUE SHED AND HAVE A BRICK BARBECUE, RIGHT ON THE CORNER FOR ALL EASTER ROASTS AND FOR, UM, BARBECUE ROAST, YOU KNOW, BRINGING THAT WHOLE PIECE BACK TO LIFE.
UM, SO REALLY THROUGH, YOU KNOW, RICHARD ALWAYS MAKES THE POINT FROM BOTH AN ARCHITECTURAL.
YOU CAN TELL A STORY IN TWO WAYS THROUGH THE OPERATION OF THE HOTEL AND THROUGH THE ARCHITECTURE AND DESIGN OF THE HOTEL.
SO CERTAINLY WITH CHRISTIAN'S EXPERTISE, WE COULD DO A FANTASTIC JOB OF TELLING THE STORY THROUGH, UM, USING TRADITIONAL MATERIALS AND ARCHITECTURE SIDE.
AND THEN THE OPERATION SIDE IS WHERE IT REALLY COMES TO LIFE THROUGH MUSIC, THROUGH DINING, THROUGH ART, THROUGH STORYTELLING.
WE HAVE, UM, TVS AND MUSIC AND SOUND DOMES AND THE POWER PLANT THAT PLANT RIVERSIDE DISTRICT, WHERE WE TELL THE HISTORY OF THAT POWER PLANT INTERVIEW AND INDIVIDUALS, UM, FROM ALL THE WAY BACK AND WHEN THE POWERPOINT OR DECADES AFTER THE POWER PLANT WAS BUILT TO TELL THEIR STORY OF IT AND EDUCATE PEOPLE WHEN THEY COME INTO THE LOBBY AND THAT YOU, YOU REALLY LEAVE WITH A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF, OF THE HISTORY AND THE TIME PERIOD OF THE PLACE IN WHICH YOU'VE ARRIVED IN, OR WHEN YOU LEAVE THAN WHEN YOU ARRIVED.
SO IT'S TRULY AN EDUCATIONAL JOURNEY ON WHAT WE DO, AND I INVITE YOU TO EXPLORE ANY OF OUR PROPERTIES AND IT'S ALWAYS A UNIQUE EXPERIENCE, AND IT'S ALWAYS TELLING A STORY THROUGH EDUCATION, UM, ON EVERY SINGLE PROPERTY THAT WE DO, CHRISTIAN, YOU'RE THE ARCHITECT OF RECORD.
SO YOU'RE GOING TO BE DESIGNING THE INTERIOR AND EXTERIOR.
AND I THINK IT'S ALSO, IT'S IMPORTANT TO, IN CONTEXT TO SAY, THIS IS NOT THE LAST TIME YOU'RE GOING TO SEE US.
WE REALIZE THIS IS A LONG JOURNEY.
AS WILLIAM SAID, HE'S BEEN WORKING REALLY FOR OVER A YEAR NOW JUST TO COME TONIGHT FOR YOUR DECISION.
AND WE WILL BE BACK AGAIN, OF COURSE, BECAUSE THERE'S A LOT OF WORK STILL TO DO.
THERE'S A LOT OF DESIGN WORK AND WE RECOGNIZE THE IMPORTANCE OF THE ROLE THAT THE HPC PLAYS.
AND REALLY WE SEE THE PARTNERSHIP OF THAT, UH, THAT THE FUNCTION OF THAT IT'S, IT'S IMPORTANT TO BE FIERCELY PROTECTIVE OF THE QUALITY OF BLUFFTON.
SO, UM, TONIGHT IS JUST ONE STEP IN A LONG PROCESS, BUT I'M EXCITED.
WE, UH, HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH THE KESSLER COLLECTION ON A NUMBER OF OTHER PROJECTS.
I CAN ATTEST TO THEIR COMMITMENT, TO QUALITY AND TO AUTHENTICITY AND TO MAKING EACH PROPERTY REALLY ABOUT THE PLACE THAT IT'S IN.
AND I KNOW THAT'S OUR COLLECTION THAT MR. KESSLER IS EXCITED ABOUT DOING SOMETHING IN BLUFFTON.
HE'S A, HE'S A NATIVE OF THIS AREA.
SO I THINK THIS WOULD MEAN A LOT TO HIM AND I KNOW BEING CLOSE TO HOME, HE, HE WILL PUT EVERY, EVERY BIT OF ENERGY HE HAS INTO MAKING IT, EVERYTHING THAT WILLIAM HAS STARTED TO DESCRIBE TONIGHT.
SO I GUESS WE'RE GOING TO BE OPEN FOR DISCUSSION.
UM, YEAH, PLEASE, IF SORRY TO INTERJECT ONE MORE TIME.
MR. ADAMS, I'M APPRECIATING US.
YOU KEEP KEEPING US ON THE ABOVE AND, BUT Y'ALL BORED, YOU KNOW, SOME OF, SOME OF THE DUDE THAT ROBERT'S RULES AND DO ALL THAT.
THANK YOU FOR, SO I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THE APPLICATION THAT'S BEFORE THE COMMISSION TONIGHT, IT'S AN APPLICATION FOR THE DEMOLITION.
I'M JUST GOING TO SAY THAT WE'VE HEARD A LOT ABOUT POTENTIALLY MOVING IT, RELOCATING IT.
UM, THAT APPLICATION IS UNFORTUNATELY NOT BEFORE THE HPC DENIED OR FORTUNATELY, UM, AND THEY CAN'T REALLY BE DECIDED IN MY OPINION, WITHOUT A, YOU KNOW, A POTENTIAL LOCATION TO PUT THAT STRUCTURE THERE, IF THAT WAS WHERE THE HBC WAS GOING.
ALSO, WE'VE ALL, WE'VE HEARD A LOT ABOUT THE FUTURE PLANS FOR THE PROPERTY, WHICH MAY OR MAY NOT OCCUR IN OUR CONTINGENT UPON A NUMBER OF
[01:55:01]
DIFFERENT VARIABLES WHILE OBVIOUSLY THE HBC CAN TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION WHAT THE FUTURE IDEAS ARE FOR PRESERVING THE NATURE AND THE LEGACY, ULTIMATELY, UM, IT, AGAIN, IT'S CONDITIONAL, IT'S CONTINGENT UPON OTHER THINGS.SO IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT THAT YOU FOCUS ON THE FACTS THAT ARE BEFORE THE HPC TONIGHT THAT ARE VERIFIABLE, THAT ARE IN THE APPLICATIONS.
SO WHAT ARE THE CRITERIA AND AS THIS PROJECT, AND WITH THAT, I'M JUST GOING TO ASK, OKAY, WITH, WE'VE HEARD THE OPPORTUNITIES AHEAD OF US, IS THERE A WAY THAT WE COULD FORMULATE THE MOTION SO THAT IT TIES SPECIFIC TO KESSLER? AND SEE THE CONCERN I HAVE IS IF NOW THE PROPERTY'S GONE AND KESSLER WALKS AWAY AND THEN SOME OTHER GROUP COMES IN, HOW DO WE CREATE THE BOND? SO THAT THE WONDERFUL STORIES WE'RE HEARING ARE NOT GOING TO WALK AWAY FOR SOME UNBEKNOWNST REASON THAT WE CAN'T FORESEE DOES THAT, DO YOU KNOW WHAT I'M TRYING TO? I DO.
AND THAT'S THE, THAT'S THE TROUBLE.
UM, AND THAT'S PART OF WHY I INTERJECTED IT'S.
AND AGAIN, WHAT'S YOUR, WHAT YOU HAVE BEFORE YOU AS AN APPLICATION FROM THE PROPERTY OWNERS, UM, MRS. MISSILES SINGLETON, AND HER FAMILY TO IT BOTH IT'S THE PROPERTY OWNER AND KESSLER.
AND THAT INCLUDES BOTH RELOCATION AND DEMOLITION ON THE CERTIFICATE.
THE, THE APPLICATION ITSELF GIVES YOU THE, UH, RELOCATION OR THE DEMOLITION.
AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE LANGUAGE AND THE APPLICATION, IT HAS TO DO WITH DEMOLITION, AND THAT THE REASON I'M BRINGING THIS UP IS BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT STAFF ADDRESSED IN THEIR STAFF REPORT.
UM, AND THERE'S NOT BEEN A LOT OF CONTEXT OR INFORMATION ADDED AS TO THE RELOCATION AND A POTENTIAL LOCATION THAT IT WOULD GO TO.
AS FAR AS YOUR, YOUR QUESTION, MR. CHAIRMAN, CAN THERE BE SOME SORT OF PROVISIONS OR CONDITIONS ADDED TO THE DEMOLITION THAT WOULD BE CONTINGENT UPON, UM, MR. KESSLER OR THE APPLICANT DOING SOMETHING WITH THE PROPERTY? IT REALLY IS GOING TO DEPEND ON WHAT THOSE CONDITIONS MAY BE.
MY INITIAL REACTION IS TO TRY TO AVOID THAT BECAUSE AGAIN, THEY, THE KESSLERS HAVE A CONTRACTUAL INTEREST IN THE PROPERTY, BUT ULTIMATELY THE SINGLETON FAMILY IS THE ONE THAT OWNS IT.
AND ULTIMATELY IF THEY DECIDE TO DO THE DEMOLITION, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE BOUND UPON.
THEY MAY NOT BE, IT'D BE VERY DIFFICULT TO BIND THEM TO CONDITIONS THAT WERE IMPOSED BECAUSE OF THE KESSLER GROUP.
AGAIN, IT'S JUST ABOUT TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT IT WORKS OUT IN THE END, WHICHEVER WAY Y'ALL WANT TO GO.
I, MY PREFERENCE WOULD BE TO HEAR WHATEVER YOUR CONDITIONS ARE AND SEE IF WE CAN'T TRY TO INCORPORATE THAT IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.
I THINK WE CAN DO IT AND WE'RE OPEN TO, YEAH, IT'S JUST, UH, IT'S SOMEWHAT CONFUSING, BUT I ALSO DON'T, I'VE SEEN IT IN OTHER POSSIBILITIES THAT THIS GETS DEMOLISHED, THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN SOME NEW DEVELOPER COMES IN AND THROW SOME CRAZY THING IN A VERY GOOD, OKAY.
SO FOR STARTERS, I WAS GONNA BRING ATTENTION THAT, THAT THERE'S LAYERS OF INFORMATION HERE RIGHT NOW.
WE'RE ONLY BEING ASKED TO DECIDE ON DEMOLITION.
I LOVE THE IDEA OF THIS BOUTIQUE HOTEL.
UM, BUT WE'RE ONLY BEING ASKED ABOUT THE DEMOLITION.
SO IF WE STAY RIGHT ON DEMOLITION, I THINK WE CAN COME TO SOMETHING THAT REGARDLESS OF WHO IS INVOLVED, UH, WOULD BE EFFECTIVE GOING FORWARD.
UM, AND JUST ON, ON, FROM, FROM MY POINT OF VIEW, I'VE WALKED THE PROPERTY A COUPLE OF TIMES, THE LAST TIME WAS WITH THE WHOLE GROUP.
AND, UM, I FEEL THAT THE 1930 STRUCTURE IS WHAT IS THAT CHARACTER TO FINDING CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
AND THE HISTORY OF THIS BUILDING IS NOT JUST THE JOINER FAMILY HISTORY.
IT IS PART OF A BIGGER HISTORY.
IT'S PART OF BLUFFTON HISTORY.
AND EVEN SOME OF YOUR OWN ARGUMENTS WERE REINFORCING MY FEELINGS ABOUT THIS BUILDING.
WHEN YOU SAY THERE'S NOTHING LEFT, THEY'VE ALL BEEN TORN DOWN.
WELL, WE GOT TO HOLD ON TO THIS ONE THEN.
RIGHT? SO, UM, I DON'T AT ALL FEEL LIKE IT NEEDS TO SAY WHERE IT IS.
AND I'VE SAID THAT FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE FIRST TIME WE SAW THE, THE, UM, REQUEST FOR DEMOLITION.
AND I SAID, NO, I DON'T WANT TO SEE THIS BUILDING GO AWAY, BUT IT CAN CERTAINLY BE MOVED OFF OF THIS PROPERTY.
AND I'VE NEVER HAD A PROBLEM WITH THAT.
AND I THINK THAT THAT IS INDEED.
SOMETIMES WHAT WE HAVE TO DO THAT IS THE COMPROMISE IS TO BE ABLE TO MOVE IT PREFERABLY WITHIN THE, UM, CAN SAY THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, CAUSE IT'S NEIGHBORHOOD GENERAL, SOMETHING WITHIN OLD TOWN, UH, BUT NOT NECESSARILY OUT IN THE MIDDLE OF BUFORD COUNTY IF POSSIBLE.
BUT, UM, IN MY OPINION, I THINK WE SHOULD APPROVE DEMOLITION FOR EVERYTHING
[02:00:01]
EXCEPT THE 1930 ORIGINAL STRUCTURE, UH, WHICH WOULD ALLOW FOR THAT TO BE MOVED TO ANOTHER PIECE OF PROPERTY.UM, I'M JUST GOING TO KIND OF, YES, WELL, THIS IS A GENTLEMEN, UH, HONEY, IT'S, UH, HOW ARE WE GOING TO DO THIS? UM, MR. CHAIRMAN, IT'S REALLY UP TO YOU AND THE BOARD AS TO, I MEAN, AT THIS POINT, WE'RE WHERE WELL WITHIN IT SHOULD BE UP TO THE COMMISSION TO DISCUSS, IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS THAT YOU WANT TO POST TO OTHERS, I WOULD RECOMMEND THAT YOU, YOU CALL THEM UP TO ASK IF SOMEBODY HAS INFORMATION THAT THEY WANT TO BRING TO YOUR ATTENTION.
UH, I BELIEVE YOUR NAME IS JOEL.
COULD YOU INTRODUCE YOURSELF? AND, UH, YOU CAN TAKE YOUR MASK OFF AND TALKING TO THE MICROPHONE, PLEASE.
MY NAME IS JOEL YEAGER, AND I LOOKED AT THE PROPERTY OH, A COUPLE OF DAYS AGO ABOUT LOOKING AT RELOCATING IT AND, UH, HAD A CONTRACTOR LOOK AT IT WITH ME.
AND IT'S REALLY NOT REALLY A QUICK RELOCATABLE.
I REALLY DON'T THINK IT'S FEASIBLE, NOT FEASIBLE, OR IT'S NOT COST-EFFECTIVE BECAUSE THAT'S A REALLY IMPORTANT, I DON'T, IT MIGHT BE FEASIBLE.
IT IS CERTAINLY NOT COSTING ME.
IT WAS, COST-EFFECTIVE NEVER COMES INTO IT.
WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PRESERVATION OF, OF A RARE THING, ANYTHING THAT'S WORTH SAVING, YOU DON'T REALLY WORRY TOO MUCH ABOUT THE COST-EFFECTIVENESS OF IT.
UM, BUT I JUST, I THINK THE REALLY IMPORTANT THING IS, IS IT FEASIBLE AT ALL OR IS IT GOING TO FALL INTO PIECES AS SOON AS YOU, AS SOON AS YOU SHORE IT UP AND TRY TO MOVE IT? I DO NOT BELIEVE SO.
HE DID NOT BELIEVE SO EITHER MR. CHAIRMAN AND FAIRNESS TO THE, UH, TO THE APPLICANT.
UM, I, I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THIS, TO BE HONEST, I DON'T KNOW, UM, THE INFORMATION, WHETHER IT'S BEEN VERIFIED, WHETHER IT'S BEEN PROVIDED TO THE APPLICANT IN ADVANCE, THIS IS, UM, THE APPLICANT SHOULD HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO THOROUGHLY RESPOND TO ANY SORT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHETHER THIS PROPERTY COULD BE RELOCATED BECAUSE THAT IS A, YOU KNOW, A POTENTIAL ISSUE MOVING FORWARD.
AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT THEY'VE BROUGHT UP.
I THAT'S PART OF THE REASON WHY I'M A LITTLE CONCERNED WITH BRINGING THIS INFORMATION IN, AFTER THE APPLICANTS HAD THEIR OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK.
AND SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE THE COMMISSION TO DISCUSS THE INFORMATION THAT HAS BEEN PRESENTED IN THE, IN THE PACKAGE HAS BEEN BEFORE YOU TAKE IN THE PUBLIC COMMENT THAT OCCURRED DURING THE PUBLIC HEARING AND THE TESTIMONY PRESENTED BY THE APPLICANT BY STAFF TODAY.
SO THAT MOVING FORWARD OVER, I GUESS WE APPRECIATE IT, JOEL.
I JUST, JUST TO GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND ON WHERE I'M GOING WITH THAT IS I'VE BEEN IN HISTORIC PRESERVATION FOR A LONG, LONG TIME.
I WAS A FEDERAL HISTORIC PRESERVATION OFFICER AND WE HAVE MOVED SOME CRAZY FRAGILE BUILDINGS.
SO I HAVE A REAL HARD TIME BELIEVING THAT IT CAN'T BE MOVED AT ALL.
UM, AND I WOULD RATHER TRY AND HAVE IT FAIL THAN JUST SAY, IT'S NOT GONNA WORK.
UM, SO THAT'S JUST WHERE I'M COMING FROM.
SO MY CONTRACTOR HAD SAID YOU WOULD HAVE TO SO SIGNIFICANTLY TEAR DOWN THE EXISTING PORTION THAT WHAT'S LEFT REALLY WOULDN'T BE MUCH MORE THAN THE SIDING AND THE ROOF AND THE ROOF IS ONLY ABOUT 20 YEARS OLD.
SO YOU WOULD LOSE SO MUCH OF THE HISTORIC NATURE OF THE BUILDING BY REBUILDING IT JUST SO YOU COULD MOVE IT.
SO THERE REALLY JUST WOULDN'T BE MUCH LEFT OF THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE TAKING INTO ACCOUNT.
THANK YOU, JOSH, COULD YOU COMMENT ON THIS? I KNOW THAT YOU'VE BEEN INVOLVED IN A NUMBER OF THESE AND IT WOULD BE A GOOD, UH, INPUT, PLEASE.
IT'S CERTAINLY POSSIBLE TO BE MOVED.
IN MY EX IT, YES, IT'S CERTAINLY IT IS POSSIBLE FOR IT TO BE RELOCATED.
UM, YOU KNOW, IN REQUIRES A GREAT DEAL OF SHORING UP, BUT HOLD ON, WE, IT'S HARD FOR US TO HEAR YOU, SO WE NEED YOUR VOLUME TURNED UP, PLEASE.
IT IS POSSIBLE TO BE FOR THIS BUILDING TO BE RELOCATED.
IT WOULD REQUIRE A GREAT DEAL OF SHORING UP, UM, AND THERE WOULD BE SELECTIVE DEMOLITION NECESSARY TO, TO FULLY ASCERTAIN ITS STRUCTURAL INTEGRITY AS TO, AS TO WHAT MEMBERS, WHAT STRUCTURAL MEMBERS FRAME AND MEMBERS CAN BE MAINTAINED IN WHICH ONES ARE DETERIORATED, YOU KNOW, BEYOND THE ABILITY TO RESIDE IN A, IN A RESTORED STRUCTURE.
BUT SO IT'S, IT'S CERTAINLY POSSIBLE.
I DID HAVE TWO QUESTIONS MR. CHAIRMAN, THAT I WANTED TO DIRECT TOWARDS MR.
AND THOSE, THE FIRST ONE IS IN 2006 DURING THE MASTER PLAN
[02:05:01]
PROCESS, WAS THERE A CONVERSATION OR WAS THERE CONSIDERATION CHRISTIAN TO THIS STRUCTURE AND WHAT WOULD, WHAT WAS GOING TO BE DONE WITH IT IN ORDER TO PLACE TOWN HALL ON THIS PIECE OF PROPERTY? THAT'S THAT'S THE FIRST QUESTION.AND THEN THE SECOND QUESTION MAY NOT BE BEST ANSWERED BY, BY YOU CHRISTIAN, BUT IT'S IN 2008, WHEN IT WAS PLACED ON THE REGISTRY AS A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, CAN THAT, CAN THAT PROCESS AND THE HAPPENINGS THERE? WAS IT AN APPLICATION? WAS IT A DESIGNATION BY THE HISTORIC SOCIETY? HOW DID THAT HAPPEN? I'D LIKE TO KNOW THOSE TWO THINGS.
UM, CERTAINLY, UM, NOT THE SECOND, BUT, UH, FOR THE FIRST, THE QUESTION ABOUT DURING 15 YEARS AGO DURING THE OLD TOWN MASTER PLAN PROCESS.
AND I THINK WE, WE HEARD THE ANSWER TONIGHT.
THE BUILDING HAD NOT BEEN IDENTIFIED AS BEING CONTRIBUTING AT THAT TIME.
AND SO IT DIDN'T ENTER INTO THE CONVERSATION.
CERTAINLY THE, THE CIVIC IMPORTANCE OF THE SITE WAS SO OVERWHELMING THAT IT, IF THERE WAS CONSENSUS AROUND THAT THIS SITE DEMANDED TO THE SITE DEMANDED TO CONTRIBUTE MORE TO THE, TO THE TOWN.
AND AT THE TIME THERE WAS UNCERTAINTY ABOUT WHERE TOWN HALL WOULD BE.
THIS WAS THE MOST IMPORTANT SITE IN TOWN.
AND THAT WAS REALLY WHAT LED TO THAT PLANNING, UH, DURING THE, THE OLD TOWN PLANNING PROCESS.
UM, AND THE FACT THAT THIS BUILDING I BELIEVE, WAS IN THE CONSERVATION NEIGHBORHOOD, NOT IN THE NATIONAL REGISTER DISTRICT.
SO IT DIDN'T HAVE THE TIME, YOU KNOW, OF COURSE, AS TIME GOES ON, AS WE KNOW, UM, BUILDINGS ARE ADDED TO THE LIST BASED ON AGE OR INTERPRETATION, SO THAT I THINK THAT'S REALLY THE, THE OUTCOME THERE.
SO IF WE COME TO SORT OF FROM 10,000 FEET AND THINK ABOUT IT, THIS IS STILL THE MOST IMPORTANT SITE IN TOWN FOR SOMETHING THAT REALLY CAN CONTRIBUTE TO THE PUBLIC.
AND CERTAINLY THAT'S THE REASONING.
I KNOW THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE, WE'RE NOT DECIDING ON THAT TONIGHT.
UM, BUT, UH, TO THE SECOND QUESTION, I'M NOT SURE MAYBE, UH, PRESERVATION STAFF CAN SPEAK TO THAT.
I DON'T KNOW THAT WE HAVE MUCH INSTITUTIONAL HISTORY HERE TO BE ABLE TO TALK ABOUT THAT.
WHEN DURING, DURING THE 2008 DESIGNATION, WAS THAT DONE ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS OR DID THEY DO IT AS A MULTIPLE BUILDING DESIGNATION? DO WE KNOW? I BELIEVE IT WAS PRESENTED TO TOWN COUNCIL ALL AT ONE TIME.
SO IT WAS, IT WAS MULTIPLE, IT WAS, IT WAS A MULTIPLE PRESENTATION.
UM, IT WAS PRESENTED TO HONG COUNCIL AS A PRESENTATION WITH MULTIPLE BUILDINGS IN IT.
HOWEVER, UM, THEY DID GO THROUGH THE BUILDINGS AND TAKE OUT THE ONES THAT THEY DIDN'T NEED AN AD.
I DON'T THINK THAT THEY ADDED ANY BEYOND WHAT WAS IN THE SCOPE.
UM, BUT THERE IS, UH, AN OLD SLIDESHOW THAT HAS THE REMOVED SIDES PULLED FROM IT THAT WERE BUILDINGS THAT DIDN'T, DIDN'T MEET THE STANDARD.
THEY WENT THROUGH EACH, EACH INDIVIDUAL ONE, BUT IT WAS PRESENTED AS, AS A PACKAGE THAT WAS THEN REVIEWED BY COUNCIL.
SO IF THAT'S ALL RIGHT, YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS OR NO, I'M JUST LISTENING.
UM, I'M JUST THINKING THE POINT OF THE PRESERVATION COMMISSION AND, AND RESTORATION IN GENERAL IS NOT TO HANDCUFF THE OWNERS.
AND I THINK IN THIS CASE, THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT IT'S DOING, UM, BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T COME TO THIS DECISION.
UM, I MEAN, IT SOUNDS LIKE THEY'VE PUT IN A LOT OF DUE DILIGENCE AS FAR AS, UM, FINDING OUT HOW MUCH IT WOULD COST HER STORE AND, UM, WHETHER IT WOULD BE AS MOVABLE, YOU KNOW, FEASIBLE OR COST EFFECTIVE.
BUT I THINK, UM, LIKE I THINK YOU HAVE TO BALANCE THAT.
AND I DON'T THINK THAT, UM, I THINK IT'S TAKEN THE BALANCE AND TIPPING IT TOWARDS THE HISTORIC PART, BUT, UM, IN THE UDA, THE APPLICATION REVIEW CRITERIA, UM, THERE LET'S SEE, UM, CRITERIA.
SO THE FIRST IS THE EXISTING AND HISTORICAL OWNERSHIP AND USE, UM, IN RECRUIT, EXCUSE ME, BUT THE OWNERS ARE REQUESTING IT.
THE SECOND IS, UM, THE DEMOLITION DEMOLITION OF THE STRUCTURES NECESSARY TO ALLEVIATE A PUBLIC THREAT OR A PUBLIC SAFETY.
AND WHILE IT'S NOT A THREAT, YOU OBVIOUSLY CAN'T ACCESS IT.
UM, SECONDLY, THERE'S NO OTHER REASONABLE ALTERNATIVES TO DEMOLITION.
[02:10:01]
UM, I'M SURE IT IS VERY POSSIBLE TO MOVE THE BUILDING.AND I THINK THAT THAT WOULD BE ALL OF OUR FIRST CHOICE, BUT IF IT HINDERS THEM FROM GOING FORWARD, I THINK THAT THAT, UM, GOES BACK TO THIS.
UM, AND THEN THE THIRD IS THE DENIAL OF IF THE DENIAL OF THE APPLICATION HAS A RESULT OF THE REGULATIONS AND STANDARDS DEPRIVE THE APPLICANT OF REASONABLE ECONOMIC USE OF, OR RETURN OF THE PROPERTY, THOSE THREE THINGS.
AND I THINK IT'S PRETTY CLEAR.
UM, WHEN I FIRST SAW IT AND BEGIN THE PRESENTATION AND YOU FOLKS DID A WONDERFUL JOB, ALL OF YOU IS I WAS TEAR IT DOWN.
AND THEN AS PEOPLE BEGAN TO TALK AND TALK ABOUT HOW, UM, LAND HAS BEEN THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN FOOTPRINT IN OLD TOWN, BLUFFTON HAS BEEN REMOVED, IT CHANGED, IT MOVED ME IN A DIFFERENT DIRECTION, AND THAT'S KIND OF REFERRING TO WHAT ELAINE, I BELIEVE YOU SAID EARLIER, RIGHT? UM, I FELT LIKE SOME OF YOUR ARGUMENTS ACTUALLY MAY HAVE SWAYED ME IN THE OTHER DIRECTION BECAUSE I MAYBE REALIZED THAT THIS IS ONE OF THE LAST BASTIONS OF, OF, OF THAT TIME PERIOD FOR, FOR AFRICAN-AMERICAN HISTORY.
BUT I'M ALSO COGNIZANT OF THE FACT THAT THIS IS YOUR FAMILY HOMESTEAD AND, UH, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY DREAMS OF HAVING SOME VALUE ON THEIR FAMILY HOMESTEAD AT TIMES.
UM, I CAN'T SPEAK TO WHETHER A NEW HOTEL AND BOUTIQUE IS GOING TO BE THE BEST REPRESENTATION OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN HISTORY OR ANY HISTORY.
I'M SURE IT'LL, IT'LL, IT'LL BE BEAUTIFUL IN, IN AND DONE VERY TASTEFULLY.
BUT I ALSO THINK THAT THERE'S VALUE FOR THE NEXT GENERATION FOR, YOU KNOW, WE'RE TALKING THAT YOU, YOU FOLKS ARE, ARE, ARE THE CHILDREN AND GRANDCHILDREN OF THE ORIGINAL OWNERS.
AND AT SOME POINT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE GRANDCHILDREN.
YOU MAY ALREADY HAVE, OR GREAT GRANDCHILDREN THAT NEED TO HAVE THAT, THAT REFLECTION OF THAT TIME, PERIOD IT, AND UNDERSTAND WHAT LIFE WAS LIKE.
AND, AND THERE'S NO BETTER WAY THAN, THAN GOING TO HISTORICAL SITES AND VISITING THEM NOW SAYING THAT IT HAS TO BE HERE.
IT SOUNDS TO ME LIKE IT CAN'T BE MOVED AND CAN'T BE SALVAGED.
UH, I DON'T KNOW, BUT I JUST WANTED TO TALK YOU THROUGH MY MINDSET OF THAT PROCESS AND, AND UNDERSTAND IT.
IT'S, IT'S A DIFFICULT DECISION THAT, THAT, THAT WE HAVE TO MAKE BECAUSE THERE, THERE, THERE ARE ARGUMENTS FOR BOTH SIDES OF IT.
UM, AND, AND BEING A HISTORY, HISTORIAN MYSELF, YOU KNOW, THERE IS VALUE IN THAT IDEA OF A KID WALKING IN THERE AND, AND STANDING THERE AND GOING BACK IN TIME AND UNDERSTANDING WHAT LIFE WAS LIKE FOR YOU GROWING UP IN THAT HOUSE, WHEN THEY HAVE CELL PHONES IN THEIR HAND, AND THEY DON'T HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT, WHAT LIFE WAS LIKE BACK THEN.
SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S A CATCH 22.
I WOULD TAKE MY SON INTO THAT HOUSE.
YOU CAN'T EVEN WALK THROUGH THE DOOR.
HE WOULD FALL THROUGH THE FLOOR.
I'M EMBARRASSED BY THAT HOUSE.
THERE IS NOTHING THERE THERE'S, THIS IS PRIDE TO ME BECAUSE THAT'S NOT WHAT I WOULD, I WOULD VISIT AS A CHILD.
THAT'S NOT THAT IF YOU WALK IN THAT HOUSE, YOU WILL FALL.
I THINK THE SMALLEST PERSON IN HERE, IF THEY WALK IN THAT HOUSE, THEY GOING TO FALL THROUGH THE FLOOR.
I CAN'T SHOW HIM ANYTHING ABOUT WHAT I DID IN THAT HOUSE.
WHEN I WAS BORN UP AS A KID, WHEN I WOULD COME DOWN HERE FROM DC, WE WOULD SPEND SUMMERS IN THERE, BUT I COULDN'T TELL HIM, I CAN'T SHOW HIM ANYTHING IN THERE.
THE THING IS, IS IT, IT IS A THING.
IT HAS NO MEMORY THAT HAS NO MEMORIES.
AND TO ME, WHEN YOU COME DOWN BLUFFTON ROAD, WHEN WE COME INTO BLUFFTON AND WE USED TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AND WE SEE BLUFFED, AND IT WOULD BE WONDERFUL COMING IN THAT STICKS OUT LIKE A, FOR US.
NOW, WHEN YOU COME INTO BLUFFTON, IT DOES NOT EVEN GO INTO ANY OF THE OTHER, UM, BUILDINGS OR ANYTHING AROUND IT.
IT'S AN EYESORE AND IT NEEDS TO GO.
SO IF IT WERE RESTORED, THAT'S NOT OKAY WITH YOU RESTORED OR IT CAN ABSOLUTELY.
THERE ARE ALREADY PEOPLE SAYING THEY THEY'RE CONSIDERING IT AT WHOSE COST WE'LL FIND OUT.
HAS ANYBODY STEPPED UP TO RESTORE IT? NO ONE HAS SAID ANYTHING TO US ABOUT MAYBE ABOUT RESTORING IT AND WE DON'T WANT TO FOOT THAT COST.
[02:15:01]
SO IF IT'S, IF THE COST IS NOT GOING TO BE ON SOMEBODY ELSE AND WE'RE GOING TO STILL HAVE TO INCUR THE COST TO RESTORE IT, NO, WE DON'T WANT TO RESTORE IT.AND I DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR FOR Y'ALL TO MAKE US RESTORE IT.
I DON'T THINK YOU NEED TO SADDLE US WITH THAT COST.
IT'S NOT EVEN A CONSIDERATION.
WE'RE GETTING TO WHERE WE'RE GETTING OFF TRACK HERE.
SO THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS.
UH, APPLICANT, DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING ADDITIONAL TO ADD HERE? JUST THE POINT THAT SPEAKING WITH THE FAMILY, WE THOUGHT WE COULD DO A MORE, BETTER JOB OF DISPLAYING THE HISTORY OF THAT BUILDING THROUGH THE NEW IDEAS THAT THE JORDAN, HER FAMILY HAD SHARED WITH ME, THEN HOW IT CURRENTLY IS.
UM, AND THAT WAS OUR INTENTION.
IF, IF THE PLACE WAS DEMOLISHED AND YOU HAD CERTAIN ELEMENTS OF THAT HOUSE, AND THIS IS FALLING BACK ON THE ARCHITECT, AND I KNOW THAT THIS IS FUTURE, BUT ARE THERE CERTAIN ELEMENTS OF THE HOUSE THAT COULD BE ACTUALLY BROUGHT INTO THE NEW DEVELOPMENT THAT MAKES IT LOOK LIKE THIS I A GIFT SHOP OR SOMETHING? I DON'T KNOW.
I'M JUST, I'M THROWING A CRAZY IDEA OUT THAT THE ELEMENTS, THIS LOOK, THIS FEEL CAN BE BROUGHT INTO IF A DEMOLITION WERE TO OCCUR.
THAT MIGHT BE A LOSS OF INTEGRITY THOUGH.
ONE THING IS, I DON'T THINK, I MEAN, WHEN WE HEAR THE WORD DEMOLITION, IT SOUNDS LIKE THEY'RE GOING TO BRING A BULLDOZER AND JUST PLOW EVERYTHING TO THE GROUND AND IT BE TURNED INTO DUST.
AND THAT IS NOT THE INTENTION HERE.
IS THAT THE INTENTION? NO, IT'S NOT.
DEMOLITION IS ACTUALLY, I KNOW THAT'S TECHNICALLY WHAT'S BEFORE YOU, WE DON'T SEE THIS AS A DEMOLITION, YOU KNOW, THE, AND WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT RELOCATION OF THE CONTRIBUTING CORE OF THE OLD STRUCTURE AS AN OPTION.
AND I WANT TO I'LL COME BACK TO THAT, BUT THAT IF THAT'S A PLAN A THEN A PLAN B WOULD BE RECLAMATION.
REALLY? NO, I MEAN, THE STRUCTURE WOULD GO AWAY, BUT WE WOULD LOOK TO RECLAIM ALL MATERIALS AND THEN USE THEM IN, UH, IN PUBLIC PLACES WITHIN THE PROPERTY.
AND, AND WE HAVE A TRACK RECORD, BUT DOING THAT, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT.
NOTHING LEAVES THE SITE THAT CAN BE USED AND DISPLAYED.
SO, AND TH AND THAT BECOMES A PART OF HOW THAT STORY IS TOLD.
SO, UM, SO I WOULD SAY IT'S REALLY, IT'S NOT A REQUEST FOR DEMOLITION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, IT'S PLAN A RELOCATION PLAN B RECLAMATION.
AND THAT'S HOW, YOU KNOW, JUST FROM A, YOU KNOW, A PRESERVATION, ETHICS POINT OF VIEW, HOW WE WOULD BE APPROACHING IT, I CAN SAY THAT THAT'S DIFFERENT FROM WHAT YOUR, YOU SUBMITTED.
SO WE'RE HEARING IT IF I COULD SPEAK TO HER AND REQUESTING DEMOLITION OF THE REST OF IT FOR CERTAIN DEMOLITION OF THE REST OF IT, BUT THEN ALSO, UH, AS WE'RE HEARING, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE WILLING TO GENTLEMEN COMING IN FRONT SAYING THAT HE ACTUALLY INVESTIGATED IT FOR HIMSELF.
AND, AND I, I WANNA SPEAK TO THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, WE, WE ARE HAVING DIALOGUE WITH MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION THAT WERE ABLE TO VISIT THE SITE AND, UH, MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY.
WE WANT TO DO THE RIGHT THING.
UH, MR. KESSLER HAS OFFERED TO, AND, AND TO, UH, MS. GALLAGHER'S POINT, CAN IT BE DONE? ANYTHING CAN BE DONE.
SO IS IT IN TERRIBLE CONDITION? AND I'M A PRESERVATIONIST IT'S IN TERRIBLE CONDITION.
I MEAN, YOU, YOU DO FALL THROUGH THE FLOOR, SO IT'S, UH, IT'S A VERY DELICATE JOB TO DO IT.
CAN IT BE DONE? WE THINK IT CAN BE DONE.
UH, MR. KESSLER HAS OFFERED TO DO THAT FOR SOMEONE THAT WOULD TAKE IT TO A SUITABLE LOCATION, AND WE WOULD COME BACK TO YOU BECAUSE YOU WOULD BE APPROVING THAT.
UM, BUT HE HAS OFFERED TO, TO RELOCATE IT.
HE WANTS TO DO THE RIGHT THING AND SET IT ON NEW FOUNDATION.
SO THAT WOULD REQUIRE THE MINIMUM SHORING NEEDED IN ORDER TO DO THAT.
UM, SO, UH, WHAT I MIGHT RESPECTFULLY, UH, REQUEST IN LOOKING AT THE ACTIONS IN THE, FROM THE STAFF REPORT THAT ARE BEFORE YOU TONIGHT, THAT WE WOULD RESPECTFULLY REQUEST THAT THE HPC APPROVED THE APPLICATION FOR DEMOLITION OF NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE STAFF REPORT, BY MR. UMBURGER AND ALLOW FOR RELOCATION OF THE CONTRIBUTING BUILDING.
THAT WOULD BE PLAN A, AND THAT WOULD GIVE US THAT OPPORTUNITY.
IT WOULD ALLOW, I BELIEVE IT WOULD ALSO ALLOW FOR THE JOINERS AND THE CONTRACT TO BE COMPLETED, AND WE WOULD ALL KNOW WHAT THE DIRECTION WAS.
AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT WE WANT.
SO WE WOULD RESPECTFULLY REQUEST THAT
[02:20:01]
I SECOND THAT, BUT WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF YOU GOT PLAN A AND WHAT'S PLAN B, WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU, I HEARD THIS GENTLEMEN COME AND SAY THAT IT'S WAY BEYOND, I HEAR YOU SAYING THAT ANYTHING COULD BE DONE, BUT IF IT'S TERMITE INFESTED IN AND THEY BRING IT BACK TO US, BECAUSE WHAT WE WOULD BE APPROVING RIGHT NOW IS RELOCATION OF THAT BUILDING OF THE, OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE PORTION, THE CONTRIBUTING PART.GO DOWN THAT ROAD AND GET TO A POINT WHERE IT TRULY CAN'T BE DONE, THEN WE'LL HAPPILY COME BACK AND ADDRESS IT WITH THAT.
BUT WE'LL DO IT, KNOWING THAT WE TRIED EVERYTHING BECAUSE WE'RE ACCOUNTABLE TO, IS THERE SOME TYPE OF TIME LIMIT THAT SHOULD BE PRESENTED OR IS THERE SOME TYPE OF WHAT, HOW, HOW WOULD THAT, I GUESS I'M KIND OF, YOU KNOW, IS IT JUST OPEN-ENDED OR LOOK TO HIM? YEAH.
MAY I MAKE A SLIGHT MODIFICATION ABOUT WHAT WAS, WHAT WAS KIND OF SUGGESTING I'VE BEEN, HAS BEEN FLOATING AROUND HERE AND SEE IF IT IS ACCEPTABLE TO ALL PARTIES? UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S DIFFICULT TO APPROVE A RELOCATION WHEN YOU DON'T KNOW YOUR, WHERE IT'S GOING TO GO.
IT NEEDS TO STAY WITHIN THE LIMITS OF OLD TOWN.
WELL, YOU ALSO, I MEAN, AND THAT PUTS A LOT OF CONDITIONS UPON, YOU KNOW, FINDING THE THIRD-PARTY MY, MY RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE, UM, AND THAT WOULD ALSO GET IN THIS WALL.
SO IT GIVE STAFF TIME TO ADEQUATELY RESPOND TO A RELOCATION REQUEST.
UM, IF, IF IT'S, IF IT WORKS WITH THE APPLICANT TO GO AHEAD AND APPROVE WITH THE CONDITIONS, THE DEMOLITION OF THE NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES IN TABLE A AND TABLE, THE PENDING APPLICATION AS TO THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, UM, FOR, YOU KNOW, UNTIL THE NOVEMBER OR OCTOBER MEETING, WHATEVER WORKS WITH THE APPLICANT'S TIMELINE, TO PROVIDE THEM AN OPPORTUNITY TO, TO AMEND THEIR APPLICATION, TO PRESENT THE POTENTIAL RELOCATION PLAN, GIVE THEM ENOUGH OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT THAT, AND HOPEFULLY BE ABLE TO KIND OF STREAMLINE THE NEXT STEP OF THIS APPLICATION IN A FEW MONTHS, RATHER THAN CONDITIONING IT ON SOMETHING THAT COULD OR COULD NOT OCCUR AND WOULD SET THIS ALL THE WAY BACK TO THE VERY BEGINNING.
I APPRECIATE THOSE COMMENTS GOING BACK TO THE EARLIER POINT ABOUT THE WAY THAT THE CONTRACTS WERE WRITTEN AND BEING ABLE TO MOVE FORWARD AT DEFINITIVE DECISION BY HBC NEEDS TO BE MADE ON RELOCATION OR DEMOLITION OF THE CONTRIBUTING PIECE.
OTHERWISE, WE WON'T BE ABLE TO CLOSE ON THE CONTRACT AND WE'LL WE'LL HAVE MADE THE PROGRESS THAT BOTH THE JOYNER FAMILY AND OUR GROUP HAS BEEN LOOKING AT.
IS THERE A TIME, IN OTHER WORDS, 12 MONTHS TO FIND A SUITABLE, WE MAKE A MOTION THAT SAID, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE TO DO THIS IN 12 MONTHS, AND I GUESS, AND I'M HEARING, YOU KNOW, THE CLOSE ON THE PROPERTY, UH, SO THAT THEY CAN MOVE FORWARD.
UH, YEAH, IT JUST MEANS WE CAN'T TABLE IT, RIGHT.
IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR? SO NOTHING, WE CAN HAVE IT, WE CAN HAVE IT APPROVED FOR RELOCATION WITHIN 12 AND WITHIN 12 MONTHS, THE HPC WILL APPROVE A LOCATION WITHIN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT YOU'VE SUGGESTED.
UM, THAT WAY WE KNOW WE'VE GOT AN ANSWER WE'RE ALLOWED TO RELOCATE IT.
AND IF YOU DON'T FIND A PLACE, NOBODY WANTS IT AND IT COMES BACK.
I GUESS I'LL ALL WE'RE SUPPOSED TO DO TONIGHT IS DECIDE WHETHER THEY CAN DEMOLISH THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.
WE HAVE TO FOLLOW THE UDL, ALL BUILDINGS, THE WHOLE, AND THEY'VE SEPARATED THE MOUNTAIN IN THE REQUEST, RIGHT? SO WHAT WE NEED TO BASE EVERYTHING ON IS WHAT THE UDL TELLS US WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE DOING, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE FOLLOWING.
ALTHOUGH THEY DO MENTION MOVING THE STRUCTURE.
I DON'T THINK THAT THAT DOESN'T THE APPLICATION AND ALLOW FOR BOTH.
I MEAN, I KNOW YOU KIND OF CLARIFY TO, AND THIS IS JUST WITH THE APPLICATION, THERE ARE THREE DIFFERENT CHECK BOXES YOU CAN DO, YOU KNOW, DO NEW CONSTRUCTION.
AND THEN I THINK IT'S SOMETHING LIKE RENOVATIONS OR ADDITIONS TO EXISTING CONSTRUCTION.
AND THEN THE THIRD CHECK BOX IS DEMOLITION OR RELOCATION.
AND SO THE, BUT THE APPLICATION THAT, UH, THE STATEMENT IS FOR THE DEMOLITION, UH, THE DEMOLITION OF A STRUCTURE OR STRUCTURES AT THE LOCATION, UM, TO ANSWER THE EARLIER QUESTION ABOUT GOING AHEAD AND ISSUING A CONDITIONAL RELOCATION.
AGAIN, MY PRIMARY CONCERN IS THAT THERE IS, IT'S ULTIMATELY IN Y'ALL'S, THIS IS Y'ALL'S DECISION, WHATEVER YOU WANNA DO.
UM, BUT IN TRYING TO GUIDE THAT DECISION, TO MAKE SURE THAT IF ANYBODY CHALLENGES IT, IT WAS STANDS LEGAL SCRUTINY IS THAT TOWN STAFF HASN'T HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO RESPOND
[02:25:01]
TO ANY RELOCATION APPLICATION, TO ANY EXTENT AT THIS MOMENT, BECAUSE THERE'S ALREADY APPLICATIONS.UM, AND SO THEY DON'T KNOW WHERE IT'S GOING YET, BUT IT WOULD BE A PRELIMINARY APPROVAL FOR RELOCATION DEPENDENT ON WHERE IT GOES OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
I DON'T WANT TO, I DON'T WANT TO HINDER THEM, BUT WE WANT TO.
AND BECAUSE THEN THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE POINT IS, YOU KNOW, IF THE RELOCATION HAPPENS, IT'S GREAT, YOU KNOW, EVERYONE'S GOOD, BUT, AND THAT'S RIGHT.
I'M TRYING NOT TO HINDER THIS WHOLE PROCESS.
UM, THE APPLICATION AT STATE THOUGH, THE RELOCATION OR DEMOLITION, I MEAN, IT SOUNDS LIKE THAT WOULD COVER BOTH OF THEM.
I MEAN, DO THEY REALLY NEED A SEPARATE APPLICATION? IF THE BOX IS CHECKED, IT'S ABOUT, IT'S ABOUT GIVING STAFF THE OPPORTUNITY TO RESPOND WELL, AND BECAUSE IT DOESN'T SAY ACTUAL APPLICATION, AGAIN, IT'S JUST A CHECK BOX.
SO IF YOU WERE DOING A RENOVATION VERSUS AN ADDITION, UM, YOU WOULD HAVE THE, I MEAN, IF YOU LOOK AT THE PROJECT DESCRIPTION, MR. EICHER JUST BROUGHT THIS UP FOR ME IS REQUESTING DEMOLITION OF DILAPIDATED STRUCTURE ON 2 0 9 BLUFFTON ROAD SLASH NINE BRUIN ROAD.
AND THAT IS, I MEAN, AGAIN, IT'S THE, THE RELOCATION OR DEMOLITION IS REALLY JUST A VERY HIGH-LEVEL MATTER OF OKAY.
WHICH KIND OF, UH, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK AT HERE? UM, WHAT ARE THE CRITERIA THAT'S GOING TO HAVE TO BE CONSIDERED, BUT THE ACTUAL APPLICATION AND THE PROJECT NARRATIVE DOESN'T REALLY ADDRESS RELOCATION.
NOW, AGAIN, IT'S UP TO THE HPC TO DECIDE WHAT Y'ALL WANT TO GRANT AND HOW YOU WANT TO GRANT THE MOTION COULD BE MADE.
AND WITH THAT CAVEAT, REALLY, THEY DON'T HAVE TO APPLY FOR IT WHEN YOU CAN JUST MAKE THE MOTION AND SAY, THIS IS WHAT THE MOTION IS GOING TO BE.
AND, UH, YOU KNOW, RELOCATE SOMETHING WITHIN OLD TOWN.
AND, AND THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION WAS THAT THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE NOT BE DEMOLISHED.
I BELIEVE THAT'S HOW THEY SAID IT.
SO IT STILL FALLS WITHIN WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
UM, THEY SHOULD, THEY'RE AGREEING TO MOVE IT AND TRYING TO WORK THAT OUT IS A WAY TO COMPROMISE.
AND I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD PUNISH THEM BY LIKE GOING BACK TO A CLERICAL.
I DON'T THINK WE NEED TO HOLD THEM UP.
I THINK THAT WE CAN MAKE A MOTION THAT STATES WHAT WE WANTED TO STATE AS A TECHNIQUE.
IS THERE ANY OTHER FURTHER DISCUSSION THAT NEEDS TO BE MADE AT ALL? WELL, DOES THE STAFF HAVE ANY OTHER CONTRIBUTING INFORMATION? OKAY.
UM, IF I MAY JUST THE, MY CONCERN WITH, IN ADDITION TO WHAT, UM, MR. BRUCE HAS BROUGHT BEFORE YOU, IF A CONDITIONAL APPROVAL IS ISSUED FOR THE RELOCATION OF, OF THIS STRUCTURE, UM, THAT HAS A TIMELINE OF, OF ONE YEAR OR WHATEVER THAT DATE THAT IS PLACED ON IT MAY BE, AND IT IS NOT MET.
THEN THE APPLICATION EXPIRES, MEANING THEY HAVE TO START AGAIN WHERE IF THE APPLICATION IS TABLED, IT CAN BE TABLED FOR UP TO 180 DAYS.
HOWEVER, IF THE INFORMATION, IF, IF A RELOCATION IS, IS PROVIDED TO US TOMORROW, THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY FOR IT TO BE HEARD WITHIN 30 DAYS.
UM, AND SO IT, IT MAY ACTUALLY, AND WHICH WOULD SEND, HELP ME IF I'M COMPLETELY OFF BASE HERE.
BUT MY CONCERN IS THAT IT MAY SOUND LIKE A QUICKER TIMELINE TO PUT SOMETHING CONDITIONAL ON IT.
BUT IF THE CONDITIONS ARE NOT MET, EXACTLY, IT COULD PUT IT INTO A CIRCLE OF DOOM WHERE IT COULD NOT BE APPROVED BECAUSE IT IS NOT WHAT WAS APPROVED.
AND THAT WOULD PUSH THEM EITHER BACK TO SQUARE ONE, WHICH WE DO NOT WANT TO DO, UM, OR, OR PUT IT IN, IN A LIMBO THAT CANNOT BE MET BECAUSE IT DOESN'T MEET THE APPROVAL AND YOU GET STUCK IN WHAT I CALL THE CIRCLE OF DOOM.
UM, BUT IF IT IS, IF IT IS TABLED, IT COULD BE BROUGHT BACK AT THE OCTOBER SIX, THIRD, WHATEVER THE FIRST ONES DID MONTH MEETING TOWARDS THE TABLE, LITERALLY.
I JUST WANT TO BRING THAT TO YOUR ATTENTION, THAT IF A, IF A CONDITIONAL APPROVAL IS ISSUED, THAT THEN CANNOT BE MET, THEN IT CANNOT EVER GET A FINAL APPROVAL, WHICH MEANS A NEW CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, WHICH GOES BEFORE THE HPRC, THE DRC, AND ET CETERA, MUST BE SUBMITTED FOR REVIEW.
CAN WE ADD A CAVEAT THAT SAYS WHAT, LIKE, IF A, IF IT DOES NOT, IF IT'S NOT MET WHAT WILL HAPPEN
[02:30:01]
AND THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION IS WHAT YOU'VE BEEN IN THIS RODEO BEFORE, COULD YOU POSSIBLY FIND SOMEBODY AND MOVE THIS STRUCTURE IN A 12 MONTH PERIOD BY LINING UP CONTRACTORS, BY LINING UP THIS, ALL THE OTHER STUFF? I MEAN, COULD THE THING MOTION BE PUT TOGETHER THAT THE PLACE HAS BEEN FOUND, BUT IT'S NOT MOVED YET BECAUSE I'M SURE THAT THAT'S GOING TO BE A, UH, YOU KNOW, TO GET PERMITS AND EVERYTHING ELSE, IT'S GOING TO BE A CUMBERSOME PROCESS.COULD YOU PUT SOMETHING TOGETHER THAT YOU FIND AND YOU LOCATE AND YOU HAVE SOMEONE, AND IT WILL BE MOVED IN A EXPEDIENT MANNER AFTER THE 12 MONTH, UH, DUE DILIGENCE OF FINDING THE, I'M JUST TRYING TO THINK THROUGH THIS.
DOES THAT MAKE ANY SENSE TO ANYBODY DURING THAT 12 MONTHS? THEY CAN GO AHEAD AND DEMOLISH THE BUILDINGS THAT WE'VE GIVEN THEM PERMISSION TO DEMOLISH.
I'M TRYING TO WRITE A MOTION FOR Y'ALL BASED OFF OF WHAT I'M HEARING, BUT I, IF I CAN GET SOME CLARIFICATION ON ONE PARTICULAR ISSUE, AND THIS IS IT'S REALLY IS MAYBE A BETTER SUMMARY OF WHAT I WAS TRYING TO SAY EARLIER, BEFORE Y'ALL IS AN APPLICATION TO DEMOLISH A CONTRIBUTING.
YOU HAVE INDICATED THAT Y'ALL WAS SUPPORTIVE OF A RELOCATION.
ULTIMATELY, WE STILL NEED TO ADDRESS THAT ISSUE AS TO WHETHER WE ARE GOING TO APPROVE THE DEMOLITION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, SUBJECT TO THE CONDITION THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY GO 12 MONTHS AND REASONABLE WITH REASONABLE EFFORTS TO TRY TO RELOCATE, OR ARE YOU GOING TO DENY THE DEMOLITION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, HOWEVER, A CONDITIONAL GRANT OF A RELOCATION.
SO I THINK, BECAUSE THAT SOUNDS LIKE WHAT WE'RE, WE'RE WORKING TOWARDS.
SO THE NOT, SO IT WOULD BE A DENIAL WITH THE CONDITION THAT THERE'D BE A CONDITIONAL APPROVAL OF A RELOCATION PENDING ADDITIONAL INFORMATION REGARDING LOCATION AND FEASIBILITY.
BUT AGAIN, I'M GOING BACK TO THE POINT OF THEM FINDING AND LOCATING IN HAVING AN APPROVED CONTRACT SIGNED BY THIS WILL ALLOW THIS PROPERTY TO BE PUT ON THEIR BUILDING, BE PUT ON THEIR SITE, BUT THEN FOR YOU ACTUALLY DO THAT, IT'S GOING TO TAKE MORE TIME AND EFFORT, I THINK.
YEAH, I, AND IF I'M, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, I THINK, I THINK THE, THE SITE, THE DESTINATION SITE WOULD BE A SEPARATE APPLICATION THAT YOU WOULD BE REVIEWING.
SO I THINK WHAT WE CAN ACCOMPLISH TONIGHT IS ASSUREDNESS THAT THE NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES CAN BE REMOVED AND THE, THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE CAN BE RELOCATED AND IT MAY NOT EVEN NEED A TIMELINE THAT PROVIDES AN ASSURANCE.
AND THEN IT GIVES US DIRECTION ON WHAT WE NEED TO DO NEXT.
AND YOU WILL SEE US AGAIN WHEN WE FIND THAT LOCATION AND WE WILL, AND IT WILL TAKE TIME TO PROVIDE OR UNDER YOU, YOU WANT TO GET IT DONE.
YEAH, I THINK THAT'S, THAT'S REALLY WHY THIS APPLICATION CAN BE CLOSED WITH THE KNOWLEDGE OF KNOWING THAT WE HAVE PERMISSION TO SEEK THE RIGHT SITE FOR IT.
AND THEN WE WILL COME BACK WITH OBVIOUSLY WITH A FULLY DETAILED PACKAGE SHOWING ITS EXACT LOCATION AND, AND PLACEMENT AND ALL THE ELEMENTS THAT WOULD BE IMPORTANT TO THE PRESERVATION COMMISSION.
IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE STATE SPECIFICALLY THAT THEY HAVE PERMISSION TO DEMOLISH THE NON-CONTRIBUTING.
MR. COMMISSIONER, COULD YOU, UH, WHAT, OH, JASON.
I WAS, I WAS GOING TO SAY, YOU KNOW, THE SAME THING, DO WE HAVE TO PUT A TIMELINE ON THIS TO WE, CAN WE MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE DEMOLITION OF THE KNOCK AND FREEDOM INSTRUCTORS AND THE RELOCATION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE WITHOUT A TIMELINE WITH, WITHOUT, OR WITH I'M DOING NOTHING YOU'RE MUMBLING, UNFORTUNATELY, WITHOUT A, WITHOUT A TIMELINE, WITHOUT A TIMELINE, BECAUSE THE TIMELINE IS GOING TO BE SET BY THEM BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO WANT TO START THE PROCESS.
THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE MESSING AROUND WITH THIS POSE A PROBLEM.
SO WITHOUT A TIMELINE, I MEAN, DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO YOU GUYS? CAUSE I KNOW THAT AND YOU GUYS WANT TO DO IT.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? REGARDLESS? IT SHOULD JUST BE NOTED THAT A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS EXPIRES TWO YEARS AFTER THE DATE OF ISSUANCE.
SO THERE WILL ALWAYS BE SOME SEMBLANCE OF A TIMELINE, BUT IT WON'T NECESSARILY BE ONE THAT IS TWO YEARS.
AND I THINK I, AGAIN, I THINK I'M, I'M TRYING NOT TO BE, UH, TRYING NOT TO JUST BE A HURDLE FOR Y'ALL TO TRY TO, UH, TRY TO CLEAR OR CAUSE ANY TROUBLE WITH GETTING THIS MOTION DONE.
BUT THE ISSUE THAT I'M STRUGGLING WITH AT THE MOMENT
[02:35:01]
IS, YOU KNOW, IT'S CERTAINLY, IT'S VERY CLEAR APPROVED DEMOLITION OF THE NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES WITH CONDITIONS AT FOURTH IN THE STAFF REPORT, UM, THAT TO DENY THE APPLICATION, TO DEMOLISH THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE AND THEN THREE, IT WOULD BE APPROVED THE RELOCATION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE.AND IT'S THE CONDITIONS UPON THE RELOCATION AS MR.
SO A CONDITIONAL APPROVAL PRIOR TO THE APPLICATION BEING RECEIVED DOESN'T OR TO RECONCILE.
I MEAN, BECAUSE IT'S GOING TO BE DEPENDENT UPON A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT APPLICATIONS, INCLUDING CONSIDERATION OF ALL THE COFA HD CRITERIA.
UM, WELL WE'RE GIVING THEM PERMISSION TO MOVE IT.
THAT'S ALL WE CAN DO RIGHT NOW.
THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH A SEPARATE PERMIT TO PUT IT SOMEWHERE AND THAT'S A DIFFERENT STEP.
IT DOESN'T REMOVE THEIR PERMISSION TO MOVE IT.
SO THEY HAVE THE PERMISSION TO MOVE IT.
THEY JUST HAVE TO NOW GO THROUGH THAT WHOLE PROCESS OF THIS IS WHERE WE'RE GOING TO.
SO THAT'S ANOTHER, BRING IT BACK AND YOU SAY HERE IT IS GREAT.
THEY WOULD HAVE TO DO REGARDLESS RIGHT THROUGH THE PROPER CHANNELS AND EVERYONE'S BEST INTEREST TO SEE RELOCATED AND PRESERVED.
I THINK IF YOU COULD, UH, UH, SHARE YOUR EMOTION WITH SOMEONE ON THE COMMISSION SO THEY COULD, UH, UH, IF THAT'S OKAY, THAT WOULD BE NOW IS THERE YOU'RE GOING TO TYPE IT OUT AND IT'S GOING TO, MAN.
ISN'T IT CERTAINLY AN INTERESTING, IT'S GOING TO BE VERY COOL.
WELL, AND THAT'S JUST, I'VE BEEN TO HIS CHARRETTES AND I'VE BEEN TO A NUMBER OF THE THINGS THAT HE'S DONE.
SO I GUESS I HAVE FAITH IN YOU TOO.
I THINK IT'S, YOU KNOW, THE POSSIBILITY OF MAKING THIS LOOK KIND OF A FELLOW AT YOUR SHOW ON THE OUTSIDE, YOU DARE SAY FAKE HISTORIC.
NO, JUST SOMETHING THAT REPRESENTS SOMEHOW.
CERTAINLY WE HAVE A LONG ROAD AHEAD AND OBVIOUSLY ONE WORKING CLOSELY WITH THE TOWN AND WITH THIS COMMISSION AND OTHERS TO, TO FIND A BUILDING THAT REALLY WILL BE A TRUE CONTRIBUTION TO THE FABRIC OF THE TOWN.
AND THIS IS ONE STEP OF MANET TO MAKE THE RIGHT DECISION FROM A RESIDENT'S PERSPECTIVE.
I THINK THAT SOUNDS AMAZING A WHOLE, THE WHOLE CONCEPT AND THE PLANS, SEEING THIS AS A LITTLE GULLAH ART GALLERY NEARBY OR ANYTHING, WE CAN TURN BUILDINGS LIKE THIS AND ALMOST ANYTHING IN BLUFF CENTERS, PROPERTY AVAILABLE HERE AND THERE.
MR. MR. CHAIRMAN MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION.
UM, HERE IS IT, HERE'S MY BEST, MY BEST EFFORTS HERE.
COULD YOU PUT IT ON THE SCREEN OR HOW ARE YOU GOING TO, OR WOULDN'T OR, WELL, UM, WHAT I, WHAT I CAN DO IS READ IT ALOUD TO Y'ALL AND IF IT SEEMS CONSISTENT WITH WHAT YOU'RE DOING, UH, WE CAN JUST SAY A MOTION TO ADOPT AND YOU'RE WILLING TO I'LL MAKE A MOTION YOU'LL MAKE, OKAY, SO I'LL LET YOU, I'M GONNA WRITE IT DOWN.
SO IT WOULD BE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE DEMOLITION OF THE NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES ON THE PROPERTY WITH CONDITIONS SET FORTH IN THE STAFF REPORT AND TO DENY THE DEMOLITION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE ON THE PROPERTY AND TO APPROVE THE RELOCATION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE CONDITION UPON APPROVAL OF A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS HD FOR THE RELOCATION LOCATION.
I'M SORRY, HOW DID THE LAST ONE AND TO APPROVE THE RELOCATION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, CONDITIONED UPON APPROVAL OF A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS HD FOR THE POTENTIAL RELOCATION LOCATION.
Y'ALL DIDN'T GIVE ME, GIVE ME A LOT OF TIME.
AND I WAS UNDER SOME FRESH, LEGAL, LEGAL WAY THAT I CAN'T FIND LOOK AT YOUR LAPTOP.
SO I WOULD, IS, ARE WE READY? YEAH, I THINK WE ARE.
[02:40:01]
I THINK LET'S MAKE A MOTION IF YOU'RE WILLING TO MAKE IT.I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE, COULD SHE SAY AS READ BY YOU OR DID SHE HAVE TO REPLETE? I'LL READ IT ALOUD AGAIN AND THEN, UH, COMMISSIONER BELL, IF YOU'LL JUST, IF YOU'LL JUST SAY SO MOVED.
SO, UM, A MOTION TO APPROVE THE DEMOLITION OF THE NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES ON THE PROPERTY WITH CONDITIONS AS SET FORTH IN THE STAFF REPORT TO DENY THE DEMOLITION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE ON THE PROPERTY AND TO APPROVE THE RELOCATION OF THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE CONDITIONED UPON THE APPROVAL OF A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS HD FOR THE POTENTIAL RELOCATION SITE.
SHE MADE A MOTION, SO MOVED IT.
SO I NEED A SECOND ON THIS, PLEASE.
SECOND THAT, AND I NEED ANY FURTHER DISCUSSIONS ON THIS.
OH, I'M LOOKING FOR A VOTE ALL IN FAVOR.
ANY OPPOSED? MOTION PASSES SPOKEN SO ELOQUENTLY.
UH, I GUESS, UH, WE'LL BE SEEING YOU, UH, AFTER YOU HAVE A LOCATION LOCATION SITE, I'M GOING TO, I'M GOING TO USE THAT IN FUTURE CONVERSATIONS, THE RELOCATION LOCATION, LOCATION.
AND THANK YOU ALL MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION AND MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC.
AS WE TRIED TO WORK THROUGH THAT, I KNOW THAT WAS A COP.
THAT WAS A, AND WE APPRECIATE BEING RIGHT IN LEGAL SO THAT THE TOWN DOESN'T GET INTO JEOPARDY OF SOME SORT.
SO IT'S A, WE'VE HAD, IT LOOKS LIKE WE'VE HAD TWO COMMISSIONERS STEP OUT AND PRO PERHAPS JUST FOR A, YES, WE HAVE A FIVE MINUTE BREAK MOTION.
FIVE MINUTE BREAK, TAKE A FIVE MINUTE BREAK A SECOND.
UH, OH, ANY DISCUSSION? ALL IN FAVOR.
[02:46:44]
WE DO HAVE, UH, TWO MORE ITEMS ON OUR AGENDA FOR THIS EVENING.WHAT IS THE TIME? THE TIME IS 8 45.
SO I THINK WE COULD GET THROUGH THESE BEFORE NINE 30.
UH, AND THANK YOU FOR, UM, UNFORTUNATELY YOU WERE PUT ON THE AGENDA AT A LOWER POINT, BUT WE APPRECIATE YOU WAITING AND, UH, BEING AROUND HERE AND WE HAVE A, AN APPLICANT FOR THE NEXT ONE.
I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE THE ONE TO TAKE THIS OVER.
MR. CHAIRMAN TONIGHT, BEFORE YOU, YOU HAVE A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO ALLOW THE CONSTRUCTION OF A ONE-STORY CARRIAGE HOUSE OF APPROXIMATELY 920 SQUARE FEET TO BE LOCATED AT 22 STOCK FARM ROAD.
THIS IS LOT 34 IN THE STOCK FARM DEVELOPMENT.
IT'S OBVIOUSLY IN THE OLD TOWN, BLUFFTON HISTORIC DISTRICT, BUT AS ZONED NEIGHBORHOOD GENERAL HD, IT IS LOCATED RIGHT HERE.
SO JUST BEFORE THE CURVE, AS YOU COME AROUND, UM, I GUESS IT'S TWO BEFORE THE CURVE HAS STOCK FARM ROAD ONE ON THIS ROAD THAT I CAN NEVER, EVER PRONOUNCE.
UM, YOU RECOGNIZE THIS PROPERTY BECAUSE THIS PROPERTY CAME BEFORE YOU JUST A FEW MONTHS AGO.
UM, THEY'VE DECIDED TO CHANGE THE DESIGN OF THE CARRIAGE HOUSE STRUCTURE.
SO THIS WOULD REPLACE THE APPROVAL THAT IS CURRENTLY IN PLACE, UM, FOR A TWO-STORY CARRIAGE HOUSE THAT WAS BUILT WITH IT.
SO YOU HAVE STOCK FARM ROAD HERE ON YOUR RIGHT, AND THEN YOU HAVE THIS OTHER ROAD ON THE LEFT-HAND SIDE OF YOUR SCREEN.
UM, THE CARRIAGE HOUSE THAT WE WERE SPEAKING OF TONIGHT IS ON THE LEFT-HAND SIDE OF YOUR SCREEN AND WOULD BACK UP TO THAT REAR ALLEY.
SO THIS IS THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE THAT YOU ALL SAW JUST A FEW MONTHS AGO.
THERE WAS A CARRIAGE HOUSE IN THE SAME LOCATION, BUT IT WAS A DIFFERENT CONFIGURATION.
AND TONIGHT WE WERE REVIEWING THIS ONE, UM, THIS CARRIAGE HOUSE IS MOSTLY AN OPEN AIRED STRUCTURE.
SO THE MAIN, MASSIVE, THIS IS A CARPORT TYPE STRUCTURE.
THERE IS SOME HOG BOARD IN BETWEEN, UM, COLUMNS THAT, THAT SCREENS THE CAR AND THE OTHER STORAGE ITEMS FROM VIEW, UM, WITH THIS SMALL PORTION HERE ON THE LEFT-HAND SIDE, UM, BEING ENCLOSED.
SO THAT AREA RIGHT THERE ON THE LEFT IS THE ENCLOSED PORTION.
THIS IS OPEN AIR WITH, YOU CAN SEE THE TWO COLUMNS AT THE FRONT HERE WITH THE AREA FOR A CAR IS A CAR PORT.
AND THEN THERE ARE MORE COLUMNS AT THE BACK.
THIS IS THE BREEZEWAY THAT ATTACHES TO THE HOUSE, THE TOP OF YOUR SCREEN.
SO FROM THE FRONT ELEVATION, THIS IS WHAT YOU'D SEE IF YOU WERE STANDING ON THAT ROAD THAT I CANNOT PRONOUNCE SMILE.
SMILAX MILAX IS THAT IT? OKAY.
I ALWAYS WANT IT, I WANT TO CALL IT LIKE SIMILAR EXPERTISE, LIKE A BABY FORMULA, BUT YEAH, THIS IS MY LEGS.
MY LEGS NOT SIMILACS THE BABY FORMULA.
SO SMILAX IS THE FRONT ELEVATION FOR WHAT IS BEING PROPOSED HERE? IT IS ACTUALLY THE REAR OF THE LOT.
UM, BUT IT IS A, IT IS A ROAD AS WELL.
SO THIS IS WHAT YOU'D SEE FROM THERE.
IT HAS THE DOUBLE FRENCH DOORS HERE THAT WOULD INTER THAT ENCLOSED SPACE WITH THE COLUMNS THAT ARE AT THE FRONT.
AND YOU SEE THE HOG PANELING BEHIND THIS IS THE REAR ELEVATION.
SO THIS IS WHAT FACES THE HOUSE.
UM, WITH THE BREEZEWAY ATTACHING RIGHT HERE, THERE IS A SINGLE DOOR TO THE STORAGE AREA ON THIS ELEVATION.
IT HAS THE HARDY, HER, THE HARDY VERTICAL BOARD AND BATTEN ON THE FIRST STORY.
AND THEN ON THE SIDE ELEVATIONS, YOU ARE ABLE TO, OOPS, I MISSED THEM SOMEWHERE BESIDE
[02:50:01]
ELEVATIONS THAT EASTERN WEST, YOU CAN SEE HERE, THIS HORIZONTAL LAP SIDING IN THE GABLED END, IT HAS THE SAME METAL ROOFING AS THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE.AND IT HAS THE SAME SHUTTERS AND WINDOW PATTERN AS THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE AS WELL.
SO YOU CAN SEE THE WALL SECTIONS HERE.
AND THEN THIS IS FROM THE PREVIOUS ONE.
THEY HAVE UPDATED THE PLANS, BUT I DIDN'T HAVE THE DIGITAL VERSION HANDY WHEN I WAS MAKING THIS POWERPOINT.
SO JUST THE RED THINGS ARE THE THINGS TO BE NOTED.
THE SHUTTERS THEY'RE, THEY'RE LABELED AS NOT BEING DURABLE WOOD, BUT THEY WERE, THEY WERE UPDATED TO BE DURABLE WOOD.
I JUST STOLE THE POWERPOINT SLIDE FROM THE PREVIOUS PRESENTATION.
IT WILL BE THREE FEET ABOVE GRADE FOR THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE.
AND THIS WINDOW IS CENTERED ON THE COLUMN HERE.
SO, UM, WITH THOSE EXCEPTIONS, THIS IS WHAT THE FRONT HOUSE, THE FRONT OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE LOOKS LIKE.
UM, THE RIGHT SIDE ELEVATION WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THAT SHUTTER RIGHT THERE BEING REMOVED.
AND THEN THE REAR ELEVATION HERE AND THE, UH, LEFT SIDE ELEVATION.
THEY HAVE DONE AN AMENDMENT SINCE THE APPROVAL OF THIS TO REMOVE THE, UM, PANELING HERE AND JUST INFILL THAT WITH SCREEN, THERE WAS A CHIMNEY IN THERE THAT, UM, IT WAS AN ELECTRIC FIREPLACE THAT IS NO LONGER BEING PROPOSED.
SO, UM, THAT WAS, THOSE WERE THE ELEVATIONS FOR THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE OF THE LANDSCAPE PLAN WOULD REMAIN FROM WHAT THE, UM, CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE INCLUDES.
AND AS THE HPC, YOU HAVE THE AUTHORIZATION, UM, UNDER THE UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT ORDINANCE TO APPROVE, APPROVE WITH CONDITIONS OR DENY THE APPLICATION IS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT.
ONCE YOU'VE REVIEWED THE CRITERIA SET FORTH IN SECTION 3, 18, 3 OF THAT UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT ORDINANCE AND STAFF FOUND THIS DOES MEET THOSE REQUIREMENTS OF 3 18, 3, AND RECOMMENDS APPROVAL WITH NO WITH NO CONDITIONS.
UM, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.
WE DO HAVE THE APPLICANTS HERE WITH US TONIGHT TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF THE PROJECT.
AND I'M HAPPY TO GO BACKWARDS BECAUSE I SPOKE REALLY FAST.
WELL, LET'S SEE, LOOKS LIKE YOU'RE SAYING THE STAFF HAS NO NOTHING TO SAY LOADED.
SO WITH THAT APPLICANT, DO YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT YOUR PROJECT? WE HAVE NO OBJECTIONS.
WE'LL ACTUALLY JUST TAKE IT AS
I WAS WONDERING, YOU KNOW, I CAN BE LONG-WINDED BUT I, WELL, WE MIGHT HAVE, WE HAD A COUPLE OF THAT ALREADY, SO I JUST THOUGHT I'D THROW IT OUT THERE JUST FOR GRIDS AS LONG AS, AS LONG AS THERE'S NO OBJECTIONS.
WELL, LET'S SEE, IT SAYS PERMISSION APPROVE THE APPLICATION AS SUBMITTED, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T, WE GET A FEW OF THESE, BUT WE DON'T GET TOO MANY OF THESE.
SO, UM, YEAH, KATIE, NOT THAT I'M COUNTING, BUT THERE MAY HAVE ONLY BEEN FOUR.
SO, SO IT'S KIND OF FUN TO GET SOMETHING LIKE THIS.
IF YOU'RE ON THE FRONT ELEVATION, ARE THOSE LIKE THE COLUMNS THAT ARE IN THE CENTER? IS THAT A, OKAY, SO CAN I COME UP TO THE MIC FOR ME, BUT IT'S THE SCENE? THE FRONT TWO COLUMNS AND THE FOUR COLUMNS IN THE BACK.
UM, UH, YEAH, SO I GUESS MY ONLY, MY ONLY QUESTION ARE THOSE COLUMNS.
AM I JUST READING THAT RIGHT? THEY DO GO TO THE TOP OF THE ROW.
LOOKS LIKE THE COLUMN BLOCKS WERE SHIFTED IN THE DRAWING, RIGHT? YEAH.
THAT'S ALL LIKE, IT LOOKS LIKE THOSE.
JUST LOOK LIKE THEY'RE, UH, FLOATING, LIKE NOT SUPPORTING, UM, I THINK THAT WAS JUST A, FROM THE ELEVATION, YOU DON'T HAVE NOTHING FLOATING.
YOU JUST HAVE A BAD PROBLEM, RIGHT? YEAH.
YOU'RE NEVERMIND YOUR KID PROD.
YOU DIDN'T WORK RIGHT BACK TO THAT, RIGHT? YEAH.
I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT IT WASN'T LIKE A PERFECT WAVE IT IN THE AIR AND I HAVE NO, ALL BE CONSISTENT.
DON'T KNOW IT'S IT'S ANOTHER VIEW.
IT'S THE, OH, I MISSED, I SEE WHERE THE, WHERE THE FRONT, THE FRONT WILL ACTUALLY MAPS THE BATH.
WELL, WHY DIDN'T YOU SAY SO I KNEW IT WAS JUST COMMON SENSE.
LET'S GO TO RECOMMENDATION AND SAYS THE COLUMNS SHOULD SUPPORT SOMETHING.
THAT'S I FIGURED, I JUST WANTED TO ASK IF YEAH, WE GOT A MOTION ON THIS.
THERE ARE FOUR COMMENTS, LIKE THE USUAL FOUR COMMENTS OR SOMETHING.
WE APPROVE THIS AS PRESENTED TO THE SECOND.
ANY DISCUSSIONS LOOKING FOR A BOAT? ALL I PROVE.
[02:55:02]
JOSH.AND SORRY TO PUT YOU ON THE AGENDA WHEN WE DID, BUT YEAH, BUT THANK YOU FOR SITTING AND LISTENING TO OUR, UH, TONIGHT'S ENTERTAINMENT, ENTERTAINMENT.
AND, UH, UM, I JUST TOLD JOSH, YOU JUST KILLED HIM AGAIN.
YOU HAVE TO MAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
I THINK WE HAVE, WE HAVE ONE MORE THING.
I THINK THERE, WELL, THIS IS DISCUSSION.
DO WE? WELL, NO, WE HAVE A DISCUSSION.
SO YOU DON'T HAVE JEREMY HAVE A DISCUSSION POINT.
Y'ALL IMPROVEMENTS TO TERMS AND DEFINITIONS.
AND WE NOW HAVE A DISCUSSION AND I BELIEVE WE HAVE CHARLOTTE.
THAT'S GOING TO BE LOOKING AT A DISCUSSION OF PROPOSED TEXT AMENDMENTS TO THE TOWN LEFT AND CODE ORDINANCE, CHAPTER 23 UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT ORDINANCE REGARDING IMPROVEMENTS TO HISTORIC PRESERVATION TERMS IN DEFINITIONS.
UM, IT'LL BE JUST ONE MOMENT TO BRING UP THE POWERPOINT.
I THINK THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL.
ONE OF THE COMMENTS I DO HAVE TO MAKE ON THIS AS WE'RE GETTING READY IS I SEE THAT ON THE PAGE THREE OF THIS, THAT THIS IS HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION SEPTEMBER 1ST, UM, AND WORK, THIS IS CONSIDERED A WORKSHOP.
SO I JUST HAVE A REAL PROGRESS ARGUMENT ON THAT, BECAUSE THIS DOESN'T SEEM LIKE IT'S A WORKSHOP.
IT'S MORE OF A, AN AGENDA ITEM.
UM, SO I'M JUST KIND OF SAYING, I WAS A LITTLE SURPRISED TO SEE THAT POP UP WORKSHOPS, ALL THE WORKSHOP AND MR. CHAIRMAN, I THINK, UH, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY THE AGENDA ITEM, WHETHER IT'S STYLED AS A WORKSHOP OR AN ACTION ITEM, IT REALLY IS JUST THAT YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BE MAKING ANY, WE'RE NOT VOTING ON DULY SQUAT VOTING ON ANYTHING TONIGHT.
IT'S FOR JUST GUESS JUST DISCUSSION PURPOSES.
SO WE DON'T VOTE WORDS LIKE DUTY SQUAT.
WE'RE JUST HEARING THE DISCUSSION POINTS AND PRESERVATION INPUT IF WE HAVE ANY.
SO I GUESS, IS THAT CORRECT, CHARLOTTE? YES.
I'M A LITTLE DISTRACTED AT THE MOMENT.
YOU'D BE PROVIDING A RECOMMENDATION TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION WHO WILL BE PROVIDING A RECOMMENDATION TO COUNCIL.
I SHOULD NOT, AND YOU'RE NOT PROVIDING A RECOMMENDATION, SO I'M SORRY.
WE'RE JUST DISCUSSING, SORRY, KEVIN PROVIDING FEEDBACK.
UM, SO LET ME, UH, LET ME GO THROUGH THIS.
I HOPE WE CAN DO THIS FAIRLY QUICKLY AND I NEED MY WE'VE GOT IT IS WORKING.
SO LET ME GIVE YOU A LITTLE BACKGROUND, A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND, WHY WE ARE PROPOSING TO UPDATE SOME OF OUR DEFINITIONS IT'S COMES OUT OF THE TOWN'S STRATEGIC PLANS, WHICH AS, YOU KNOW, OUR COUNCIL'S PRIORITIES TO, UM, IDENTIFY WHAT, UH, WE SHOULD BE FOCUSING ON OUR WORK PROGRAMS. AND IT INCLUDES SEVERAL HISTORIC PRESERVATION INITIATIVES, INCLUDING, UM, ALIGNING OUR NATIONAL HISTORIC DISTRICT, WHICH IS A SMALLER HISTORIC DISTRICT WITHIN THE TOWN OF LEPTONS OLD TOWN, BLUFFTON HISTORIC DISTRICT.
SO THE IDEA IS, TRY TO AT, WAS, UH, UH, TO PREPARE A SURVEY BACK IN 2019 TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT WE COULD ALIGN THE TWO DISTRICTS AND TO DO THAT, WE NEEDED TO HAVE A HISTORIC RESOURCE SURVEY, UM, AND THE PROCESS OF IDENTIFYING, UM, WHAT WE NEEDED TO DO TO PREPARE THAT SURVEY, TO BE ADOPTED BY TOWN COUNCIL.
WE RECOGNIZED THAT, UH, WE HAD SOME DEFINITIONS THAT NEEDED TO BE UPDATED INCLUDING ONE TO CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES.
SO THIS IS A MAP, UH, EVERYTHING YOU SEE IN GREEN AND ORANGE IS THE OLD TOWN BLUFFTON LOCAL HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE ORANGE PORTION IS THE NATIONAL REGISTER HISTORIC DISTRICT.
AND SO AGAIN, UH, UH, TOWN COUNCIL WANTED TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT THERE'S POTENTIAL TO EXPAND THE ORANGE AREA.
UM, AFTER JOINING THAT SURVEY BACK IN 2019, UM, AS PART OF, UH, THE SURVEY, UH, THAT WAS DONE, UH, OLD TOWN BLUFFTON WAS, UH, REVIEWED BY OUR CONSULTANT.
[03:00:01]
THEY ALSO LOOKED AT BUCK ISLAND SIMMONS VILLE AND GO THROUGH ERODE TO DETERMINE IF THERE WERE ADDITIONAL STRUCTURES THAT MIGHT BE ADDED, UH, AS PART OF THIS.AND IN THAT PROCESS, THEY SURVEYED OVER 400 PROPERTIES.
THE, A NUMBER OF, UH, RESOURCES THAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE RIGHT NOW IN OLD TOWN OR 84, 45 OF THEM ARE, UM, ALSO WITHIN THE NATIONAL REGISTER HISTORIC DISTRICT.
SO THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF OVERLAP THERE.
AND, UM, SO AS I INDICATED, UH, THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE DEFINITION THAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE THAT YOU SEE ON THE SCREEN HERE, UM, IS NEEDING TO BE REVISED BECAUSE IT REFERENCES THE MOST RECENT HISTORIC, UH, SURVEY, WHICH WAS BACK IN 2008.
SO IF WE WERE TO ADOPT THE 2019 SURVEY, THAT WOULD INCLUDE EVERY 400 PROPERTIES AND OBVIOUSLY NOT ALL 400 PROPERTIES CONTRIBUTE OLD TOWN.
SO THE DEFINITION, UM, NEEDS A REVISION.
AND WE HAVE A SUGGESTION HERE.
AND THIS DEFINITION, I THINK MORE FULLY EXPRESSED IS WHAT A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE IS, AS OPPOSED TO THE CURRENT DEFINITION THAT WE HAVE.
CURRENT DEFINITION BASICALLY SAYS HOW A STRUCTURE IS DESIGNATED.
AND I THINK THIS PROVIDES A LITTLE BIT MORE INFORMATION AND MAKES IT MORE UNDERSTANDABLE.
I CAN MOVE ON IF YOU'D LIKE TO DIFFERENCE IN CASE NOT TO SOUND LIKE AN EDUCATOR HERE, BUT WHEN YOU HAVE A HISTORIC NATIONAL HISTORIC DISTRICT, YOU HAVE TO IDENTIFY YOU.
WE USUALLY IDENTIFY A LOT OF CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES.
IT BENEFITS THE PROPERTY OWNERS BECAUSE THEY CAN TAKE ADVANTAGE OF FEDERAL HISTORIC PRESERVATION TAX CREDITS, WHICH ARE VERY, VERY GENEROUS.
IF YOU ARE OPERATING A BUSINESS IN THAT STRUCTURE, YOU GET LIKE 20% TAX CREDIT, WHICH IS CASH BACK IN YOUR POCKET AFTER YOU INVEST IN THIS PROPERTY OR UPDATED OR DO WHATEVER.
IT'S CHANGED THE CITIES THAT WE KNOW IT, BUT YOU'RE PROPOSING THAT FOR OUR PURPOSES HERE.
WE DON'T NECESSARILY COUNT ALL OF THOSE AS CONTRIBUTING FOR WHAT WE'RE DOING.
WE'RE GOING TO USE A, A MORE, UH, GRANULAR SET OF BUILDINGS THAT YOU'VE IDENTIFIED.
NO, AND, AND I KNOW THIS IS A LITTLE BIT CONFUSING.
SO LET ME GO BACK TO THE EXISTING DEFINITION.
THE, THERE ARE 80, THERE ARE 84 RESOURCES RIGHT NOW THAT WE'VE IDENTIFIED AS CONTRIBUTING TO THE OLD TOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT.
WE ARE NOT PROPOSING ADDING ANY ADDITIONAL RESOURCES AT THIS TIME.
WE'RE NOT PROPOSING TO REMOVE ANY, BUT WHAT WE ACKNOWLEDGE IS THAT OUR CURRENT DEFINITION, IF WE WERE TO ADOPT THE 2019 SURVEY, THAT WOULD AUTOMATICALLY INDICATE THAT THOSE 400 PROPERTIES THAT WERE SURVEYED ARE SOMEHOW CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES, WHICH THEY ARE NOT, THEY MAY NOT ACTUALLY MEET THE CRITERIA TO BE CONTRIBUTING, SAID THE DEFINITION AND FOURTH SHOTTING JUST SAYING THAT IT WAS SURVEY, DOESN'T MAKE IT CORRECT.
SO THAT'S WHY THERE NEEDS TO BE AN ADJUSTMENT BEFORE WE CAN ADOPT THAT 2019 SURVEY.
UH, SO IN THE PROCESS OF LOOKING AT NOT ONLY THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE SURVEY, WE BEGAN TO LOOK AT SOME OTHER, SIR, UH, UM, SOME OTHER, UH, DEFINITIONS IN TERMS WHETHER OR NOT THEY WERE SUFFICIENT.
AND SO THERE ARE A FEW ADDITIONAL, UM, THINGS THAT WE'D ALSO LIKE TO PROPOSE, INCLUDING A DEFINITION OF CONTRIBUTING RESOURCE.
AND THIS IS MORE OF AN ENCOMPASSING TERM.
IT INCLUDES BUILDINGS, SITES, OBJECTS, FEATURES, AND OPEN SPACES.
AND AS I MENTIONED PREVIOUSLY, WE DO HAVE TO, UM, NOT, WE DO HAVE TWO RESOURCES THAT ARE NOT STRUCTURES.
THEY ARE KOBES, HUGELY COVE AND HAYWARD COVES ARE BOTH CONSIDERED CONTRIBUTING TO OUR LOCAL HISTORIC DISTRICT.
SO THEY WOULDN'T QUALIFY AS CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES.
SO WE FEEL LIKE THIS TERMINOLOGY, THIS TERM IS IMPORTANT TO HAVE.
AND SO WE ARE RECOMMENDING A DEFINITION.
AND THEN THE OTHER THING THAT THIS TERM DOES IT REFERENCES A CONTRIBUTING RESOURCES MAP FOR THE TOWN OF BLUFFTON, UM, WHICH WOULD NOT BE IN OUR UDL.
IT WOULD BE A STANDALONE MAP THAT WOULD HAVE TO ALSO BE, UH, UH, APPROVED BY TOWN COUNCIL.
UM, AND THIS WOULD ALLOW THE PUBLIC TO READILY ACCESS THAT INFORMATION AND TO KNOW WHAT, WHICH RESOURCES ARE CONSIDERED CONTRIBUTING.
AND I KNOW RIGHT NOW, I THINK THERE'S BEEN A LITTLE BIT OF CONFUSION WITH THE PUBLIC FINDING THAT INFORMATION.
SO THIS WILL BE A REFERENCE DOCUMENT, UH, FOR THE PUBLIC.
SO A FEW OTHER TERMS THAT WE'RE PROPOSING EITHER TO, UH, REVISE OR TO ADD INCLUDES OUR EXISTING DEFINITION OF BUILDING.
UM, CAN'T SEE IT ALL RIGHT THERE.
UNFORTUNATELY, UM, JOSH AND JOSH ARE IN A WAY, BUT, UH, WASN'T HELPING ME DUCT JOSH SHELTER
[03:05:01]
THAT WORKS.UM, WHAT WE'RE, WHAT WE'RE RECOMMENDING TO DO IS JUST TO REMOVE THAT SECOND SENTENCE FROM BUILDING AND KEEP THE FIRST SENTENCE.
UM, IT'S A LITTLE PECULIAR THAT A FIREWALL AT MEANS THAT IT SHOULD BE CONSIDERED A SEPARATE BUILDING.
AND THESE ARE TERMS THAT ARE USED THROUGHOUT THE UTO.
AND, UH, ADDITIONALLY, WE'D LIKE TO UPDATE THE WORD STRUCTURE OR THE TERM STRUCTURES AS WELL.
UM, THIS TERM THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW, THE DEFINITION OF IT SEEMS A LITTLE BIT LIMITING, BUT WE WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT A STRUCTURES, ANYTHING THAT'S ATTACHED PERMANENTLY TO THE GROUND OR, OR ATTACHED TO ANYTHING THAT MAY BE FIXED TO THE GROUND.
I THINK THIS IS A MORE COMMON TERM, AND WE'D ALSO LIKE TO INCLUDE THE WORD HISTORIC RESOURCE, UM, BECAUSE IT IS USED WITHIN OUR CURRENT UDL RIGHT NOW.
UM, SO THIS IS ANY BUILDING STRUCTURE, SITE OBJECT FEATURE, OR OPEN SPACE, UM, THAT IS LISTED OR ELIGIBLE FOR LISTING ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER.
AND SO WE DO HAVE HISTORIC RESOURCES IN OLD TOWN AND OUTSIDE OF OLD TOWN.
SO, UM, POTENTIALLY, UH, WE WILL BE LOOKING AT ONCE WE MAKE SOME CORRECTIONS TO OUR, OUR, UM, UTO AMENDMENTS, AS THEY RELATE TO OLD TOWN, WE MAY BEGIN LOOKING OUTSIDE OF OLD TOWN, AND THIS IS A DEFINITION WE BELIEVE THAT WE NEED, UM, THE TERM HISTORIC STRUCTURE WE HAVE RIGHT NOW IN OUR, UH, UH, UTO IS SOMETHING THAT'S ACTUALLY NOT, UH, NECESSARY.
SO IT'S PROPOSED TO BE ELIMINATED.
WE COULD ACTUALLY REVISE THIS AND KEEP IT IN OUR ORDINANCE.
UM, BUT IT'S NOT SOMETHING A TERM THAT WE ACTUALLY USE ANYWHERE IN THE ORDINANCE, BUT IT IS DEFINED BECAUSE WE ARE PROPOSING NEW TERMS. WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO, UM, SOME ADDITIONAL AMENDMENTS HERE.
I JUST WANT TO POINT THAT OUT.
UM, SO I'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT THE TERMS AND THE DEFINITIONS THAT ARE PROPOSED.
SO WHAT WE'RE ALSO RECOMMENDING, UH, TO HAPPEN AS WELL IS JUST TO GO THROUGH THE ORDINANCE AND UPDATE THE TERMS AS THEY'RE USED.
SO THINGS LIKE HISTORIC DESIGNATION OF A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE WOULD BECOME RESOURCE POTENTIALLY.
WE MAY WANT TO, UH, DESIGNATE THE THIRD COVE, UM, VERDE OR COVE AS A CONTRIBUTING RESOURCE TO OLD TOWNS.
SO, UM, THIS, UH, CURRENTLY IS TOO LIMITING.
AND SO BASICALLY EVERYTHING ELSE HERE IS SIMILAR TO THAT AS WELL.
DO YOU HAVE ONE CORRECTION HERE WHO TALKS ABOUT ALL OTHER HISTORIC STRUCTURES THROUGHOUT THE TOWN OF BLUFFTON OR UDL IS NOT CURRENTLY SET UP TO ADDRESS ANYTHING OUTSIDE OF OLD TOWN? SO FOR THE TIME BEING WE'RE RECOMMENDING THAT THAT BE REMOVED.
AND AGAIN, WE'LL, WE'LL BEGIN LOOKING AT THOSE, UH, RESOURCES, UM, AT A LATER DATE.
AND I KNOW THAT WE DISCUSSED OTHER PROPERTIES LIKE IN PALMETTO BLUFF AND SOME OTHER BY TAKING IT OUT, WE'RE NOT GOING TO EVER INCLUDE IT AGAIN.
IF IT'S IN THERE AND IT'S BEEN IN THERE FOREVER, WHY ARE WE EXCLUDING IT NOW? WELL, I WOULD HOPE THAT WE BROADEN OUR SCOPE AND THAT IS THE INTENT TO IN THE FUTURE.
RIGHT NOW, WE ARE ONLY SET UP WITH OUR DESIGN CRITERIA TO ADDRESS OLD TOWN, UM, LEFT IN HISTORIC DISTRICT, NOT IN ANYTHING OUTSIDE OF IT.
UM, SO THAT'S WHY THAT'S RECOMMENDED TO BE REMOVED AT THIS TIME AND JUST, UH, CHANGING SOME WORDING HERE.
I, YOU KNOW, DOES ANYONE, I LOOKED UP THE WORD RESOURCE AND I DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND HOW RESOURCE TIES INTO ANY OF THIS STUFF.
SOMETIMES IT'S NOT NECESSARILY A STRUCTURE.
IT COULD BE THE COVE, OR IT COULD BE A CEMETERY, OR IT COULD BE, IT COULD BE, BUT THE RESOURCES, A MINERAL RESOURCES, CASH AND RESOURCES IS WHAT, WHAT DO YOU, HOW DO YOU TEACH? WHAT DO YOU TEACH? WE HAVE RESOURCES OUT THERE.
AND WHAT DO YOU TEACH WHEN YOU GOT A HISTORIC SITE? THE SOURCES OF RE IS A REALLY COMMON TERM.
CAUSE IT ENVELOPS ARCHEOLOGICAL SITES, UM, IMPORTANT SITES, YOU KNOW, UH, THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE MIGHT NOT, THEY'RE NOT, MIGHT NOT BE A PHYSICAL THING.
IT MIGHT JUST BE WHERE SOMETHING, I GUESS IT'S JUST FOREIGN TO ME AND NOT USED TO HEARING THAT TERMINOLOGY.
[03:10:01]
AND IT'S JUST, IT'S ALWAYS USED WITH THE WORD HISTORIC AND HISTORIC RESOURCE.SO WITH THAT SAID, WE'RE JUST USING IT AS RESOURCE.
AND WE USE IT IN HISTORIC RESOURCE, WHEREVER THESE CHANGES ARE MADE, BECAUSE WE'RE JUST CALLING IT A RESOURCE W WE ARE REFERRING TO IT AS A HISTORIC RESOURCE.
SO YOU'RE NOT IN ANY OF THESE CONSISTENCY CHANGES.
SO I GUESS I'M JUST LOOKING AT WHAT ARE WE, YOU KNOW, IT'S A RESOURCE THAT WE'RE TAKING MINERALS OUT, WE'RE TAKING, SO A RESOURCE IS AN ASSET OR A PROPERTY.
IT DOESN'T ACTUALLY HAVE TO BE MINERALS.
I KNOW INNOCENT, BUT I'M JUST SAYING A RESOURCE TO ME IS A RESOURCE.
YOU KNOW, YOU GOT RESOURCES, YOU'VE GOT CASH IN YOUR POCKET.
IT'S JUST, IT'S A REALLY GENERAL TERM.
BUT THAT'S WHY I'M LOOKING AT GENERAL TERMS. SO I DON'T KNOW.
I JUST THINK YOU WOULD WANT TO MAKE IT MORE SPECIFIC BY ADDING.
I MEAN, I KNOW IT'S IMPLIED, BUT THE HISTORICAL, THERE'S A FINE LINE THERE, BUT IT'S JUST BUGGING THE BEANS OUT OF ME.
I READ THIS THING, I READ THIS THREE TIMES, I READ THIS THREE TIMES AND I'M JUST KIND OF GOING ON.
IT'S EASIER TO SAY RESOURCE INSTEAD OF OBJECT BUILDINGS, STRUCTURES, SITES VERSUS MORE ENCOMPASSING.
MR. CHAIRMAN, HISTORICAL VALUE.
MR. KEVIN, DO I UNDERSTAND YOU WHEN YOU'RE SAYING YOU DON'T HAVE AN ISSUE WITH HISTORIC RESOURCE AFTER DISCUSSION FOR A MOMENT YOU JUST WANT EA TO SAY, INSTEAD OF THE DEMOLITION OF THE RESOURCE IS NECESSARY, YOU WANT IT TO SAY THE DEMOLITION OF THE HISTORIC RESOURCES NECESSARY? IS THAT WHAT YOU, HE JUST WANTS THE WORD HISTORIC ADDED IN.
IF YOU ADDED THE WORD HISTORIC IN FRONT OF THE WORD RESOURCE ALL THE TIME, IT MAKES MORE SENSE.
IT MAKES MORE SENSE TO ME BECAUSE NOW I'M TYING IT TO SOMETHING RATHER THAN THE WORD FLOATING OUT THERE BY ITSELF.
THAT MEANS THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT MINERALS.
I MEAN, I'M USING THAT AS AN EXTREME EXAMPLE, BUT SURE.
WE JUST FOLLOWED THE KIND OF PATTERN OF OUR CURRENT YEAR.
NO, BUT I'M TRYING TO TIE THIS.
SO IT MAKES MORE SENSE TO JOE LAYMAN READING THIS STUFF RATHER THAN, YOU KNOW, WE GOT IT MISEDUCATED OVER HERE, UNDERSTANDING IT, BUT I DON'T WELL, WITHIN THE CONTEXT HERE AT WORKS, HISTORIC RESOURCE, IT'S NOT ROUGH.
AND IT'S IN THE SECTION, USUALLY IT'S REFERENCING A CONTRIBUTING RESOURCE OR THE STORE BY RESOURCE.
IT KINDA, IT KINDA DOES WANT, UH, AN EDUCATOR.
I THINK OF HER AS A HISTORICAL RESOURCE BECAUSE SHE'S, WELL-VERSED IN HISTORY.
SO YOU JUST WANT READ TO SCRIPT HER IN FRONT OF RESOURCE, WHICH IS PERFECTLY, I JUST WANT TO REMIND YOU THAT JOSH IS ON AS WELL, JUST IN CASE HE HAD ANY COMMENTS ON THIS.
YOU GOT ANY COMMENTS WE'LL HAVE TO WAIT THE WHOLE, I WAS GOING TO SAY THAT I THINK, YOU KNOW, IT IS DEFINED IN ANOTHER AREA WITHIN THE DOCUMENTS.
SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, IT IS REFERENCED BACK TO, TO TRY TO FURTHER EXPLAIN WHAT, WHAT THEY'RE MENTIONING WHEN THEY SAY RESOURCE.
SO TO THAT POINT, YOU KNOW, IF THAT MAKES, IF THAT MAKES US FEEL ANY BETTER ABOUT IT, IT WAS A DISCUSSION POINT.
SO I THOUGHT I'D DISCUSS IT SINCE I'M NOT BASHFUL.
SO THERE'S, THERE'S REALLY, TRULY, THERE'S NOTHING MAJOR THAT'S BEING PROPOSED.
UM, THESE ARE THINGS THAT A STAFF BELIEVES ARE NEEDED, UM, TO SUPPORT THE ADOPTION OF OUR 2019, UH, HISTORIC RESOURCE SURVEY AND ALSO TO, UM, UH, MAKE, UH, THE TERMINOLOGY A LITTLE BIT CLEARER.
I WOULD SAY HISTORIC RESOURCE SURVEY BE GRADED INTO THE UDL, OR IT WON'T BE INTEGRATED INTO THE STUDIO.
AND IT WAS PARTIALLY DONE TO SEE WHETHER OR NOT WE COULD ACTUALLY EXPAND THE NATIONAL REGISTER BOUNDARIES.
I WAS JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHY, WHY THE EFFORT TO REMOVE THAT FROM HERE? CAUSE I DON'T, I, I GUESS YOU SEE MORE PEOPLE CONFUSING IT THEN THE NOT ARE, UM,
IT IS NOT, AND THAT IS PART OF THE CHALLENGE, BUT, UM, IT WOULD BE ACCEPTED SIMILAR TO HOW THE PRESERVATION PLAN FOR THE GARVIN HOUSE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT WOULD BE ACCEPTED BY THE TOWN COUNCIL.
UM, THEY, THEY ACCEPT IT IN THE PAST.
THE SURVEY HAD HAD PAGES TORN OUT OF IT.
SO IT WAS NO LONGER A SURVEY, BUT RATHER A SELECTIVE COMPILE STATION OF WHAT THEY WANTED TO BE THE RESOURCES, WHICH IS KIND OF LIKE THE 2008
[03:15:01]
ONE WAS DONE WHERE THEY PICKED PAGES OUT OF IT IN ORDER TO MAKE IT SO THAT THEY WERE ALL CONTRIBUTING RESOURCES THAT WERE BEING ACCEPTED BY COUNCIL.BUT RATHER THAN TAKE PAGES OUT OF A PILE OF DATA, WE WANT IT TO CONTINUE TO HAVE A PILE OF DATA AND THEN A PILE OF CONTRIBUTING RESOURCES.
SO THE CHANGES THAT WE ARE MAKING HERE DOES NOT CHANGE THE STATUS OF ANY STRUCTURE THAT CURRENTLY IS A RESOURCE OR CURRENTLY IS NOT A RESOURCE.
IT ONLY CHANGES THE TERM, WHICH WE REFER TO IT AND HOW YOU REFER TO THE SURVEY, WHICH IS DATA VERSUS THE CONTRIBUTING RESOURCE, WHICH IS NOT DATA.
SO WE HAVE A SET OF HISTORIC RESOURCE.
SHOULD WE SAY CONTRIBUTING RESOURCES THAT WHAT'S MEANT HERE? THERE IS ALSO THAT, RIGHT? IT DEPENDS ON THE CONTEXT, RIGHT? IN SOME PLACES IT WILL BE HISTORIC RESOURCES, SOME PLACE GOING BACK TO GOING BACK NOW WHERE WE NEVER REALLY THOUGHT TO RENAMING THIS STUFF AND I'M STILL HAVING AN ISSUE WITH THIS.
CAUSE IT JUST DOESN'T FEEL RIGHT FOR SOME REASON ANOTHER, BUT I'M GOING BACK TO DO, WE HAVE TO SEND A NOTICE TO ALL THESE PEOPLE THAT HAVE A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE AND LETS THEM KNOW, LET THEM KNOW THAT IT'S NOT CALLED A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, BY THE WAY, YOUR THING'S CALLED NOW CONTRIBUTING RESOURCE.
AND SO GENERALLY THIS ISN'T LISTED ON THE MAP ANYMORE CONTRIBUTING RESOURCE.
WHERE IS IT AS CHAIRMAN TYPICALLY WHEN WE DO A UDL TEXT AMENDMENT AND WE DON'T HAVE TO SEND INDIVIDUALIZED NOTICES BECAUSE IT'S COMPREHENSIVE IN SCOPE.
EVEN IF IT IS A PROVISION THAT WOULD CLEARLY IN PRACTICE ONLY IMPACT A FEW NUMBER OF PEOPLE, BUT THE UDA IS IT GOVERNS EVERYTHING.
AND SO WE DON'T HAVE TO SEND INDIVIDUALIZED NOTICES REALLY KIND OF JUST TO SUMMARIZE, I KNOW WE'VE GONE, WE'VE ADDRESSED A LOT OF DIFFERENT ISSUES, STRUCTURE AS A DEFINED TERM UNDER OUR UDL.
AND IT'S, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S GOT LIMITATIONS TO IT BY EXPANDING CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, TO CONTRIBUTING RESOURCE, ALLOWING MORE, TO BE COVERED AND WITHIN OUR HISTORIC DISTRICT AND THROUGH THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS HD PROCESS.
SO TAKING THAT CONTRIBUTING RESOURCES DEFINITION, AND KIND OF GIVING IT A MORE EXPANSIVE APPROACH, WE'RE EXPANDING IT TO PROTECT MORE OF THE HISTORIC ASSETS WITHIN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
AND WHILE GOING THROUGH THAT, IT'S REALLY A LACK OF A BETTER TERM FIND AND REPLACE LET'S FIND WHERE IT SAYS CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES, LET'S PUT CONTRIBUTING RESOURCES AND SOME OF THOSE OTHER PLACES THAT YOU'VE, YOU'VE KIND OF ASTUTELY POINTED OUT WHERE THERE MAY BE SOME AMBIGUITY.
I THINK THAT IT SHOULDN'T BE TOO PROBLEMATIC TO JUST CHANGE THAT OVER TO CONTRIBUTING RESOURCES.
SO, UM, AGAIN, THIS IS, UH, THE CHANGE IS REALLY TO ALLOW US PRIMARILY AND ALLOW THE TOWN PRIMARILY TO GET THAT 2019 SURVEY IN, RIGHT.
WHILE DOING THAT, WE'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO ALSO ADDRESS SOME OF THESE OTHER ISSUES.
I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT I GUESS I'M JUST TRYING TO CLEAR IT UP.
SO IT MAKES MORE SENSE IF YOU'RE READING THIS, IF YOU'RE JUST READING THIS ON ITS OWN, WITHOUT IT IT'S DIFFICULT FOR THE AVERAGE PERSON.
AND THAT'S WHO, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE A LOT OF AVERAGE PEOPLE THAT ARE TRYING TO DO PROJECTS IN THIS TOWN AND THEY'RE GOING, I GUESS.
UH, AND I TEND TO AGREE JUST, I THINK THAT THERE ARE A FEW AREAS.
I MEAN, THAT'S WHY WE BRING IT BEFORE THE HPC IS TO MAKE SURE THAT WE GET THAT FEEDBACK AND INCORPORATE THAT THOSE REVISIONS IN HERE, 'CAUSE YOU GUYS KNOW THIS AND YOU'RE IN IT ALL THE TIME.
SO, YOU KNOW, GOD BLESS YOU, BUT YOU KNOW, I'M DOING THIS AND I'M ANYONE YOU ARE ANYONE ELSE KINDA ANY INPUT? NAH, CAUSE THIS DISCUSSION ONLY.
SO IF THERE ISN'T ANY MORE DISCUSSION, THEN LET'S JUST, YOU KNOW, MOTOR RUN.
MOTION TO ADJOURN IS ALL OF THIS LEFT ON THE DOOR.
I THINK, UH, MARY, YOU WANTED TO TALK ABOUT SOME, COULD I GET A MOTION TO ADJOURN? I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN AND THERE YOU GO.
AND I NEED A SECOND ON THAT SECOND THAT, IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION BE QUIET ALL IN FAVOR, AYE.
MEETING OVER AT, UH, NINE 19 FOLKS, I GOT NERVOUS FOR A SECOND.
[03:20:24]
THE COUNTY CHANNEL IS ALSO AVAILABLE ON VIDEO ON DEMAND.GO TO BUFORD COUNTY, SC.GOV, SCROLL DOWN TO PUBLIC MEETINGS, CLICK WATCH NOW, AND THEN CLICK THE VIDEO ON DEMAND BUTTON AND SELECT YOUR PROGRAM FROM BLISS CALL TO ORDER IF YOU'D LIKE A DVD OF THIS PROGRAM, CLICK ON THE LINK ON THE RIGHT AND FILL OUT THE ORDER FORM.
AND THANK YOU FOR WATCHING THE COUNTY CHANNEL.
THIS IS THE BUFORD COUNTY MOMENT.
THE SUBJECT OF THIS MOMENT IS THE PHOSPHATE INDUSTRY LOST TO FOLKS TODAY, BUT THE ARTIFACTS, THE PHOSPHATE INDUSTRY ARE AROUND US.
IF WE LOOK FOR THEM, PHOSPHATES WERE KNOWN IN SOUTH CAROLINA BEFORE THE CIVIL WAR.
THEY WERE FIRST DISCOVERED UP AROUND SOMERVILLE AND NORTH OF CHARLESTON.
IT'S KNOWN AS MORAL AND BENEATH THE MORROW WAS THE PHOSPHATE ROCK GEOLOGISTS AND SCIENTISTS KNEW ABOUT IT.
PHOSPHATE WAS VERY IMPORTANT TO THE AGRICULTURAL OF THE SOUTH BECAUSE IT IS THE BASIS OF MOST FERTILIZER AND MANY OF THE COTTON LANDS OF THE OLD SOUTH, WHERE MUCH EXHAUSTED BY THE COTTON INDUSTRY BEFORE WAR.
SO AFTER THE CIVIL WAR, THE PHOSPHATE INDUSTRY WAS INTRODUCED FIRST IN CHARLESTON IN 1867, AND THEN LOOKING FOR BEDS OF HIGH CONTENT PHOSPHATE ROCK.
THESE PHOSPHATE EXPLORES AND ENTREPRENEURS DISCOVERED BUFORD COUNTY.
THE NEXT 30 YEARS, BUFORD COUNTY BECAME THE PRIMARY SOURCE OF PHOSPHATE IN THE UNITED STATES.
AND ONE OF THE RICHEST SOURCES OF PHOSPHATES KNOWN IN THE WORLD BETWEEN 1870 AND 1900.
THIS BECAME THE CENTER OF THE MINING.
PART OF THE PHOSPHATE INDUSTRY.
MANY OF THE FERTILIZER FACTORIES WERE IN CHARLESTON, BUT THE MINING AND THE PHOSPHATE WORKS AS THEY CALL THEM WHERE THEY BROKE THE ROCK DOWN INTO POWDER AND THE PURE PHOSPHATE AND SHIPPED IT OUT.
THOSE INDUSTRIAL CENTERS WERE MOSTLY IN BUFORD COUNTY AT THE HEIGHT OF THIS INDUSTRY IN THE 1880S, 3000 BUFORD TONES WERE EMPLOYED IN THE PHOSPHATE BUSINESS.
IN MANY CASES WAS A RULE OF THUMB WHEN THE PHOSPHATE BUSINESS BEGAN IN THE 1870S, THAT THE RICHEST VEINS OF PHOSPHATE WERE UNDERWATER UNDER THE COOSAW RIVER UNDER THE BUFORD RIVER UNDER BATTERY CREEK.
SO INITIALLY LOCAL SEA ISLANDERS WOULD DIVE DOWN FOR THE ROCK AND FILL UP BASKETS AND THEN GET PULLED UP IN A ROPE, NOT ONLY LIMITING THE DEPTH TO WHICH THEY COULD MINE AT, BUT LIMITING THEIR HEALTH AS WELL, GOING UP AND DOWN, BUT VERY QUICKLY IN THE 1870S ENGINEERS DISCOVERED THAT THEY COULD BUILD VERY LARGE UNDERWATER STEAM POWER DREDGES ON FLOATING BARGES.
AND SO THEY BEGAN TO MECHANIZE THE INDUSTRY AND RATHER THAN EMPLOYING FEWER PEOPLE THAT ACTUALLY EMPLOYED MORE, MORE THAN HALF OF THE PHOSPHATE PRODUCED IN THE UNITED STATES AND 80% OF THE PHOSPHATE PRODUCED IN SOUTH CAROLINA CAME FROM BUFORD COUNTY.
THE PHOSPHATE INDUSTRY BETWEEN 1870 AND 1900 WAS THE LARGEST INDUSTRY IN THE HISTORY OF BUFORD COUNTY AND THE LARGEST MINING INDUSTRY IN THE HISTORY OF THE STATE OF SOUTH CAROLINA.
AND PEOPLE HAVE PRETTY MUCH FORGOTTEN ABOUT IT, BUT IT WAS THE SOURCE OF GREAT PROSPERITY AND BUFORD COUNTY BETWEEN 1870 AND 1890.
THE POPULATION OF BUFORD COUNTY GREW BAY STREET BECAME A FINANCIAL AND COMMERCIAL CENTER.
PHOSPHATE WORKS IN OTHER WORDS, FACTORIES WHERE THEY BURN THE PHOSPHATE ROCK AND BROKE IT DOWN INTO POWDER.
WE'RE LOCATED ON SPANISH POINT.
WE'RE LOCATED ON LUCY CREEK AND THE LARGEST WAS LOCATED FIRST ON COOSAW PLANTATION.
AND THEN OUT AT THE END OF CHISHOLM HIGHLAND ON SUMMER HOUSE POINT ON THE NORTH SIDE OF THE COOSAW RIVER, SMALLER PHOSPHATE COMPANIES AND PHOSPHATE RIDGES AND THE TUGBOATS AND THE SUPPORT SYSTEMS THAT HAD TO SUPPORT THIS INDUSTRY FOR 30 YEARS, AN ENORMOUS BOOM TO BUFORD COUNTY.
EVENTUALLY THE SMALLER PHOSPHATE COMPANIES WERE CONSOLIDATED INTO ONE VERY LARGE COMPANY CALLED THE COOSAW MINING COMPANY.
THE KUSAMA MINING COMPANY BY 1892 WAS THE LARGEST PHOSPHATE MINING COMPANY IN THE UNITED STATES.
BUT IN THOSE SAME YEARS IN 1888, RICHARD VEINS AND PHOSPHATE WERE DISCOVERED NEAR TAMPA,
[03:25:01]
FLORIDA.AND DURING THE 1890S, THE PERCENTAGE OF PHOSPHATE EXTRACTED FROM BUFORD COUNTY DECLINED AND THE PERCENTAGE OF PHOSPHATE DISCOVERED AND EXTRACTED FROM FLORIDA AND OTHER PLACES LIKE NEAR NASHVILLE, TENNESSEE WAS RICHER PHOSPHATE.
AND EVENTUALLY IT PUT THESE PHOSPHATE MINES OUT OF BUSINESS PHOSPHATE AND BUFORD COUNTY.
THE RIVER ROCK AS IT WAS CALLED IN THOSE DAYS WAS 60% PURE PHOSPHATE, WHICH IN 1870 WAS THE BEST IN THE COUNTRY.
BY 1888, THE FLORIDA ROCK WAS 80% PURE PHOSPHATE.
AND THE ECONOMICS OF THAT SIMPLY PUT THE RIVER COUNTY PHOSPHATE BUSINESS OUT OF BUSINESS.
COOSAW MINING COMPANY STOPPED MINING IN 1905.
THE VIRGINIA CAROLINA COMPANY TRIED TO CONSOLIDATE SOME OF THE OLD WORKS AND FINALLY WENT BANKRUPT IN 1914.
AND THAT WAS THE BITTER END OF THE PHOSPHATE BUSINESS CONSEQUENCE OF THE END OF THE PHOSPHATE BUSINESS WAS THE BEGINNING OF THE GREAT EXODUS OF THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN POPULATION OF THE SEA ISLANDS WITHOUT GOOD WAGE JOBS BEGAN TO MOVE NORTH AND DEPOPULATED POPULATED MUCH IN BUFORD COUNTY.
BUT THE OTHER EVENT WHICH HASTENED THE DEMISE OF THE PHOSPHATE INDUSTRY IN BEAVER COUNTY WAS OF COURSE THE GREAT HURRICANE OF 1893, WHICH WAS ONE OF THE 10 LARGEST HURRICANES AND MOST DESTRUCTIVE HURRICANES EVER TO HIT THE UNITED STATES KILLED AS MANY AS 2000 PEOPLE ON THE SEA ISLANDS AND WRECKED THE PHOSPHATE FLEET.
SO THE INVESTORS IN PHOSPHATE FLEET MOVED THEIR CAPITAL TO FLORIDA AND THE PHOSPHATE BUSINESS DECLINED B FOR COUNTY.
THIS HAS BEEN A BUFORD COUNTY MOMENT TO SEE MORE B FOR COUNTY MOMENTS GO TO THE BUFORD COUNTY LIBRARY HOMEPAGE AND CLICK ON THE LOCAL HISTORY TAB.
MY NAME IS LANCE CORPORAL DEAN ON TRIP, WORKED FOR THE BEAVER COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE, SOUTHERN ENFORCEMENT DIVISION.
AND I'VE BEEN WITH THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE NOW FOR A LITTLE OVER FOUR AND A HALF YEARS.
IT WAS BAD AS PROPERTY, ONE TRIBE.
I WAS BORN AND RAISED ON THE HILL AND THEN ONE DAY HILTON HEAD HIGH SCHOOL.
AFTER THAT, I WENT TO UNIVERSITY OF SOUTH CAROLINA, BUFORD GRADUATED WITH A SITE DEGREE.
HABO IS WANTING TO BE IN LAW ENFORCEMENT, UM, FROM THE AGE OF 14 TO 21, I WAS IN THE EXPLORERS PROGRAM HERE WITH THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE.
THERE'S A LOT OF PROS TO BEING BORN AND RAISED HERE IN BUFORD COUNTY AND WORKING FOR THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE GEOGRAPHICALLY WHEN RESPONDING TO CALLS FOR SERVICE.
I KNOW THE AREA LIKE THE BACK OF MY HAND TIMES, I'VE BEEN ABLE TO BETTER COMMUNICATE WITH PEOPLE IN CERTAIN SITUATIONS DUE TO MAYBE ME GOING TO HIGH SCHOOL WITH THEM OR ET CETERA AT THE END OF THE DAY, IF YOU EVER COUNTED IN THIS SMALL COUNTY, EVERYBODY KNOWS EVERYBODY.
I'VE BEEN ON THE BLOODHOUND TEAM FOR ABOUT TWO YEARS.
WE'LL RESPOND TO CALLS FOR MISSING ENDANGERED PERSONS, UH, ELDERLY PEOPLE THAT HAVE WALKED OFF.
WE WILL ALSO RESPOND TO YOU ON ROBBERY CALLS.
AND WE ALSO WILL ASSIST OTHER AGENCIES IF NEEDED BEING ON A BLOODHOUND TEAM.
I GET TO DO WHAT I LOVE WORKING IN LAW ENFORCEMENT.
AND THEN ALSO BEING ABLE TO WORK IN LAW ENFORCEMENT WITH HANDLING DOGS, WHAT THEY HAVE TO PROVIDE THE TIMES LAW ENFORCEMENT CAN HAVE A LOT OF EXCITING NOMINEES, BUT WHAT'S NICE ABOUT OUR JOB IS THAT WE GET TO HELP PEOPLE SOMETIMES THAT ARE HAVING THEIR WORST DAYS.
YOU'RE NOT ALWAYS SITTING AROUND.
THERE'S ALWAYS SOMETHING DIFFERENT.
ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN THAT AT THE SPLIT SECOND EVERY DAY IS DIFFERENT DISPATCH PROBABLY DO WANT, I'M SAYING