[Call to Order]
[00:00:02]
UM, THE FIRST ITEM ON THE AGENDA IS THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
IF ROBIN, YOU CAN PUT THE FLAG UP YEP.
I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE.
AND, UH, WE'RE NOT, WE DON'T HAVE, UH, WE, WE DO NEED A MOTION TO APPROVE
[Approval of Agenda]
THE AGENDA.DO I HEAR A MOTION THAT WE APPROVE THE AGENDA WITH THE REMOTE? YOU DON'T HAVE THE MARCH 11TH COMMITTEE MEETINGS.
CANCEL, CAN YOU REMOVE THAT? YES.
UM, WITH THE REMOVAL OF ITEM D THE MARCH 11TH COMMITTEE MEETING.
I THINK MR. CAMPBELL MIGHT BE MUTED.
CAN YOU GIVE US A SECOND ON, UH, APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES OF THE AGENDA? EARL'S AND MUTED.
CAN YOU HEAR US? YOU'RE MUTED.
HE'S TRYING TO TAKE A PHONE CALL.
HERE, CAN WE GET A SECOND? THANK YOU.
ALL OF THOSE IN FAVOR, SAY AYE.
UH, THERE ARE NO PUBLIC COMMENTS.
[Tax Revenue Update]
UPDATE, ROBIN.WOULD YOU LIKE TO, UM, CAN YOU SHARE THIS SCREEN? YES.
LET ME, UH, TRY TO DO THIS ON MY OWN THIS TIME YOU CAN SHARE.
YES, I HAVE WHERE THAT'S COMING FROM.
SO, UH, WE ACTUALLY HAVE VERY GOOD NEWS TODAY AND, UH, I AM VERY PLEASED.
UH, I CONTACTED, UM, ON TUESDAY, LATE TUESDAY EVENING, I CONTACTED MARIA WALL AND ASKED HER IF THEY, IF THEY COULD SEND ME, GO AHEAD AND SEND ME THE MARCH INFORMATION A LITTLE EARLIER THAN WE HAD PLANNED.
AND SO, UM, I HAVE TWO SLIDES HERE TODAY, ONE FOR GENERAL FUND AND ONE FOR DEBT SERVICE.
AND THIS ONE IS OUR GENERAL FUND OR OPERATIONS FUND.
SO IN THE FAR RIGHT SECTION, YOU HAVE 20, 21 AND, UH, ACTUALS.
SO THOSE ARE THE ACTUAL REVENUES WE'VE RECEIVED BY MONTH BETWEEN DECEMBER IT'S ACTUALLY JULY THROUGH DECEMBER IS THE TOP THE 35,698,000, AND THEN JANUARY, FEBRUARY, AND MARCH.
AND SO AT THE BOTTOM OF THAT WHITE, UH, COLUMN IN WHITE, THERE IS 142 MILLION, $289,808 OF COLLECTIONS.
OUR REVENUES REPORTED IT IN OUR, UM, GENERAL FUND, UM, TO DATE OUR BUDGET IN THAT AREA IS IN THE COLUMN TO THE RIGHT OF THAT AT THE TOP 149,000,007 33.
SO WE ARE ABOUT 7 MILLION, $443,000 SHORT AT THIS TIME IN THE YEAR.
HOWEVER, UM, AT THE BOTTOM I HAVE, UH, HISTORICAL RECEIPTS IN THE FAR LEFT.
YOU'LL SEE HISTORICAL RECEIPTS APRIL THROUGH JUNE.
SO WHAT I'VE DONE IS TAKEN FOR EACH YEAR, UM, THE, THE COLLECTIONS FROM APRIL THROUGH JUNE, AND YOU'LL SEE THAT, UM, IN 2015 WE COLLECTED 4.8 MILLION, BUT EVERY YEAR THEREAFTER WE COLLECTED 6 MILLION, 6.7 MILLION, 6.6 MILLION WENT DOWN A YEAR AND 5 MILLION IN 2019, BUT THEN BACK UP TO 6.2.
SO AS YOU CAN SEE, WE'RE, WE'RE LIKELY TO PROJECT, UH, EXPECT TO RECEIVE AT LEAST $6 MILLION
[00:05:01]
IN THAT THREE MONTH PERIOD.SO, UM, I WOULD EXPECT THAT WE WOULD BE NO LESS THAN A MILLION TO A MILLION AND A HALF SHORT AT THE END OF THE YEAR.
AND WE COULD COME IN, UM, EVEN A HEALTHIER, YOU KNOW, AT THE SAME, UH, AT THE BUDGETED AMOUNT, WE COULD EVEN HAVE A LITTLE EXCESS, BUT THIS IS ENCOURAGING TO ME, UM, THAT WE ARE, UM, THE, THE AMOUNT LEFT TO COLLECT IS RELATIVELY SMALL, UM, AT THIS POINT.
SO I'M VERY EXCITED ABOUT THAT TODAY.
UM, AND SO THE ITEMS IN GREEN ARE, ARE THE, THE MONTHS WHERE WE'RE ABLE TO HAVE COMPARATIVE INFORMATION.
SO, YOU KNOW, THIS YEAR IT WAS DELAYED TO MARCH, BUT IT NORMALLY, YOU KNOW, OUR TAX REVENUES WOULD HAVE COME IN AT JANUARY.
SO IF WE CAN PAIR WE'RE AT 95%, UM, AT THE END OF JANUARY LAST YEAR WHERE WE WERE AT 93.9%.
SO WE'RE A LITTLE BETTER THAN AT THAT POINT LAST YEAR.
UM, AND WE'RE A LITTLE BETTER THAN THE YEAR BEFORE THAT AND SIMILAR, YOU KNOW, SO I LIKE TO LOOK AT A LONG-TERM HISTORY TO SEE, YOU KNOW, WHERE, WHERE WE ARE IN COMPARISON TO OTHER YEARS AND HOW WE ENDED UP IN THOSE YEARS.
SO, UM, ANYWAY, THAT I THINK THAT'S VERY ENCOURAGING.
UM, AND ONE LAST THING ON THIS SLIDE IS THE REVENUES RECEIVED PER MIL.
UM, SO THE BOTTOM LEFT AGAIN, UH, I PROVIDED A ROW OF ADDITIONAL INFORMATION, BASICALLY, THAT IS THE VALUE OF THE MILL THAT WE RECEIVE IN OUR, UM, GENERAL LEDGER OR OUR FINANCIALS.
AND SO EACH MILL IS WORTH, UH, IN 2020, IT WAS WORTH 1 MILLION, $303,406.
SO AS YOU CAN SEE, IT'S ABOUT, UH, UM, NO MORE THAN SAY ANYWHERE FROM A 10,000 TO A $40,000 INCREASE IN THE VALUE EACH YEAR.
SO THAT'S GONNA BE REALLY IMPORTANT AS WE BUDGET FOR THIS COMING YEAR IS TO SEE WHAT HAS THE VALUE BEEN THIS YEAR AND HOW MUCH VALUE WILL EACH MILL REPRESENT FOR NEXT YEAR.
UM, AND SO WE WANT TO, UM, DON'T WANT TO OVER PROJECT THAT VALUE, UH, OR, OR WE COULD FALL SHORT IN THAT BUDGET YEAR.
SO THIS IS IMPORTANT COMMENT ABOUT, ABOUT THE VALUE OF THE MILL, AS YOU HEARD, HOW TANYA FIGURES OUT THE VALUE OF THE MILL, IT'S THE ACTUAL VALUE OF THE MILL BY WHAT IS BROUGHT IN TO US AND PUT IN THE BANK.
AND, AND SO IT'S, IT'S A PAST DISTRICT.
WHAT THE AUDITOR HAS BEEN DOING IS HE PROJECTS THE VALUE OF THE MILL BASED ON THE BILLS THAT GO OUT THAT ARE BASED ON THE ASSESSED VALUE.
OKAY, THAT'S AN ESTIMATED VALUE, AND THAT'S WHY WE CONSISTENTLY HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE AUDITOR AND NOT AGREEING ON THE VALUE OF THE MILL IS ESTIMATE IS BASED ON HIS VALUES, BASED ON AN ESTIMATE, OUR VALUE IS AN ACTUAL NUMBER OF WHAT WE GOT THE PAST YEAR.
SO THAT IN A NUTSHELL IS WHY WE'VE BEEN HAVING THE PROBLEMS THAT WE'VE BEEN HAVING AND DISAGREEMENTS ON WHAT MILLAGE TO GENERATE THE REVENUE THAT WE NEED AS AN, IN OUR BUDGET THAT WE PRESENT, UH, TO THE COUNTY.
SO IT'S JUST, THIS REALLY POINTS IT OUT ON HOW WE LOOK AT IT.
AND OF COURSE WE CAN THEN SAY, WE CAN SAY THEM PROBABLY AS YOU LOOK AT IT, THE VALUE OF THE MILL IS FAIRLY CONSTANT AND GROWING.
AND SO WE CAN ASSUME IF WE HAD THE SAME MILLAGE THIS YEAR OR FOR THE NEXT YEAR, THAT THE VALUE OF THAT MILL WILL INCREASE AS WELL, BUT WHETHER IT INCREASE ENOUGH FOR ANY ADDITIONAL BUDGETED ITEMS THAT WE APPROVE IN NEXT YEAR'S BUDGET.
SO WE HAVE TO, WE THAT'S, THAT'S THE GAME WE PLAY WITH THE COUNTY AND, UH, IN THE SETTING OF THE MILL.
AND WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THIS IN SOME MORE DETAIL DURING FISCAL AUTONOMY.
[00:10:01]
WELL, HOW CAN WE SIT DOWN WITH THE THOUGHT IT'S OKAY TO STRAIGHTEN THIS OUT, BECAUSE I MEAN, HE CAN'T KEEP GOING DOING THIS, THIS, AND THIS CAUSED US PROBLEMS. YES.THAT, THAT IS ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT JOINT MEETING BETWEEN COUNTY COUNCIL AND THE S THE SCHOOL BOARD THAT WE TALKED ABOUT IT LAST WEEK, OR MEETING THAT IS ONE OF THE KEY TOPICS, UH, TO, TO ADDRESS.
AND I FIRMLY BELIEVE THAT THE COUNTY COUNCIL, THEY HAD THE SAME PROBLEM BECAUSE THEY SUBMIT THEIR BUDGET.
AND I REMEMBER, I THINK MS. WALLACE, SHE FIGURED THE VALUE OF THE MAIL BASED THE SAME WAY AS THAT.
TANYA, I DON'T BELIEVE, UM, THE TREASURER'S OFFICE CREATES A VALUE IN THE MAIL, BUT THIS, UH, THE, UH, CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER HAS SOME, UM, INTEREST IN THAT.
AND, UM, I BELIEVE IT SHOULD COME FROM THE ASSESSOR'S OFFICE.
I BELIEVE ORIGINALLY THE ASSESS VALUE, UM, WOULD COME FROM THERE.
BUT I HAVE SPOKEN WITH WHITNEY RICHLAND, THE NEW CFO AT THE COUNTY.
UH, I JUST TALKED TO HER YESTERDAY, SO WE'LL BE HAVING CONVERSATIONS THROUGHOUT THE PROD, THIS BUDGET PROCESS.
AND WE HAVE PLANS TO MEET AS WELL TO, UH, DISCUSS THE VALUE OF THE MILL.
AND THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR A LONG TIME, AND I KEEP TELLING PEOPLE THAT YOU ASSESSOR'S OFFICE CANNOT ANTICIPATE HOW MANY, UH, PROPERTY OWNERS ARE GOING TO SWITCH THEIR RESIDENCY FROM BEING A SECOND HOMEOWNER, THIS PAIN, OPERATIONAL TAX TO A, UH, PERSONAL HOMEOWNER, WHICH DOES NOT PAY THAT.
AND YOU SEE THE COUNTY DOESN'T HAVE THAT, THAT ISSUE.
SO THAT'S WHY IT REALLY, IT REALLY AFFECTS US MORE THAN IT DOES ACTUALLY THE COUNTY AND THEIR PROJECTION OF REVENUE.
WE JUST HAVE TO, WE HAVE TO EDUCATE, UH, THE FOLKS TODAY, UNDERSTAND HOW WE, HOW WE HAVE TO DO BUSINESS RACHEL'S HANDS UP.
UM, I THINK MY COMMENTS ARE KIND OF IN REGARD TO THE COLLECTION, UH, RATE OR PERCENTAGE.
SO, UM, IN MY OPINION, YOU KNOW, BASING, UH, THAT MILL ON WHAT IS SENT OUT MAKES SENSE.
IF, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE GOING TO RECEIVE 100% OF COLLECTIONS OF, OF WHAT YOU SEND OUT IN THAT BUDGETED YEAR.
UM, BUT IF WE'RE SEEING COLLECTION STILL COMING IN WELL PAST THAT TIMEFRAME, I THINK THAT REQUIRES A BIT OF A CONVERSATION, UM, ON OUR PART AND ON COUNTY COUNCIL'S PART TO UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, WE STILL SEE COLLECTIONS FOR BILLS THAT ARE, UM, YOU KNOW, MUCH OLDER AND WHAT IS OUR PRACTICE WITH THOSE RECEIVABLES.
AND, UM, I THINK THAT'S KIND OF THE, A LITTLE BIT OF THE, ONE OF THE, ONE OF THE ARGUMENTS OR ONE OF THE STICKING POINTS FOR THAT PROCESS.
UM, BUT I ALSO THINK THAT THAT DOESN'T OBVIOUSLY WORK FOR US.
IT MIGHT WORK FOR OTHER ORGANIZATIONS, SO WE NEED TO FIGURE OUT, UM, HOW TO INSERT THAT INTO THE CONVERSATION AS WELL.
UM, BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK AT OUR CHARTS, IT DOES SAY, YOU KNOW, IN 2015 WE SAW 102.7% OF, UM, COLLECTIONS, AND THEN OTHERS, YOU SEE IN THAT SAME MONTH, 97.5 THE NEXT YEAR.
SO THERE'S THAT, THAT FLUCTUATION IS NOT GOOD FOR US WHEN WE HAVE A SET BUDGET.
UM, AND WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE IN INSERT THAT PART OF IT INTO THE CONVERSATION THAT WE HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH COUNTY COUNCIL.
THAT'S JUST MY LITTLE PIECE ON IT.
AND IT'S, IT'S ALSO, YOU KNOW, UH, IT'S WHEN CARS ARE PURCHASED, BECAUSE A LOT OF THAT IS WHAT WE GET FROM, UH, AUTOMOBILES, BOATS, AND SO ON.
WE GET SOME MONEY EVERY MONTH, UH, FROM, FROM THAT PART OF THE, UH, THE TAX BILL.
SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S HARD TO ANTICIPATE, BUT NO, WE HAD A BIG, WE HAD A TIME AND, UH, THIS FALL WHEN CARS WEREN'T BEING PRODUCED, SO THE CAR DEALERS WEREN'T SELLING, AND SO OUR CAR TAX RECEIPTS WERE DOWN AND YOU CAN'T, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN'T ANTICIPATE THAT WHEN YOU ANTICIPATE YOUR BUDGET.
YOU WANT TO GO AHEAD TO A REVENUE SERVICE? I MEAN, UH, YEAH.
THIS IS THE DEBT SERVICE FUND.
UM, I ONLY HAVE ABOUT FOUR YEARS OF COMPARISON HERE, OR, UM, BUT OUR COLLECTIONS,
[00:15:01]
UH, OR ARE THE REVENUES REPORTED IN OUR FINANCIALS ARE, UH, 69,000,006, NINE 89, NINE OH THREE.THE BUDGET IS 72 MILLION, 2,139.
SO WE'RE AT 97.2%, UH, OF REVENUES RECEIVED.
UM, LAST YEAR WE WERE AT 95% AT THE END OF THE COLLECTION PERIOD, UH, THE PRIOR YEAR OR A LITTLE ABOVE, UH, THAT BUDGET AND THEN 97% IN 2018.
SO I, WE HAVE $2 MILLION LEFT TO COLLECT IN THE THREE-MONTH PERIOD.
UM, WE DO ALSO INCLUDE DELINQUENT TAXES IN BOTH THE OPERATIONS AND IN OUR DEBT SERVICE.
SO THESE ARE CURRENT TAXES, THEIR AUTOMOBILES AND THEIR DELINQUENT TAXES THAT COULD BE FROM PRIOR YEARS.
SO, UM, WE COMBINE ALL OF THOSE INTO OUR BUDGET, UM, AS, AS WE PLAN EACH YEAR, UM, THROUGH OUR BUDGET PROCESS.
SO HISTORICAL RECEIPTS IN APRIL THROUGH JUNE IN THE LAST THREE YEARS HAVE BEEN ANYWHERE FROM 1.9 TO $2.7 MILLION.
SO I AM PRETTY COMFORTABLE, CONFIDENT THAT WE WILL COLLECT THE 2 MILLION AND PERHAPS HAVE A SMALL EXCESS, UH, ANYTIME WE HAVE AN EXCESS, THOSE ARE, UH, WE BUILD THAT INTO THE PLAN FOR THE NEXT YEAR.
AND WE, UM, WE STRUCTURE OUR NEW DEBT TO PAY DOWN, UM, OUR PRINCIPALS, UM, FASTER IN, IN EARLIER YEARS OF OUR DEBT, UH, WHATEVER NEW DEBT ISSUANCE HAS BEEN MADE.
WE CAN'T RESTRUCTURE OLD DEBT, LIKE PAY EXTRA AN EXTRA PAYMENT ON A MORTGAGE PAYMENT.
LIKE, YOU KNOW, WE CAN PERSONALLY, BUT THE NEXT BOND ISSUE, WE CAN STRUCTURE THE PAYMENTS TO PAY FASTER EARLY ON IN THE PROCESS.
SO, UH, HOPEFULLY WE'LL BE IN A SITUATION WHERE WE CAN DO THAT.
WE CERTAINLY, THIS IS NOT A FUND WHERE WE WANT TO BE SHORT AT ALL, OR HAVE ANY HISTORY OF, OF SHORTAGES.
WE CANNOT AFFORD TO DEFAULT ON OUR, UM, OUR DEBT PAYMENTS.
SO THIS IS SOMETHING THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT COMES ABOVE, UM, ABOVE THE BUDGET AMOUNT.
SO, UM, BUT IT LOOKS AS IF THIS POINT THAT IT WILL BE, UM, WILL BE GREATER THAN IT, AT LEAST MEET, MEET THE BUDGET OR GREATER.
UM, YOU'LL SEE THE REVENUES PER MIL RECEIVED.
SO THE REVENUES PER MIL IN THE DEBT SERVICE ARE MUCH HIGHER THAN THE REVENUES PER MIL AND OPERATIONS.
AND THAT'S BECAUSE OF THE, THE RULE WHERE, UM, OWNER OCCUPIED OR PRIMARY RESIDENCES ARE NOT SUBJECT TO OPERATIONS TAXES, BUT THOSE RESIDENCES ARE SUBJECT TO DEBT SERVICE.
SO THE VALUE OF EACH MILL THAT IS TAXED OR LEVIED PRODUCES MORE REVENUE FOR US BECAUSE IT HAS A BROADER SPAN OF PROPERTIES.
SO ABOUT 1.9 MILLION IS OUR VALUE OF THE MILL IN THE DEBT SERVICE FUND, UH, AND THAT, UM, CONTINUES TO GROW EACH YEAR.
WE DON'T HAVE THE FINAL NUMBERS FOR 2021.
SO I WAS USING THAT ON A BUDGETED NUMBER.
UM, BUT THIS IS LOOKING PRETTY GOOD AS WELL.
UM, UH, OPEN IT UP FOR ANY COMMENTS YOU ALL HAVE MS. BOATWRIGHT, DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS? NO, SIR.
JUST LISTENING AND LEARNING ANY OTHER COMMENTS, ONE COMMENT, UH, I REALLY BELIEVE THE VALUE OF THE MILL, UH, FOR DEBT SERVICE IS GOING TO GO UP BASED ON THE REAL ESTATE MARKET AND ALL THESE HOMES THAT ARE BEING PURCHASED NOW ARE BEING PURCHASED AT, UH, WHATEVER THE COST OF THE AT CLOSING THAT IS THE ASSESSED VALUE OF THAT HOME.
GOOD CHANCE THAT MANY OF THE PEOPLE THAT ARE SELLING THAT HOUSE ARE PAYING LESS ASSESSED VALUE FOR THAT HOME.
THEY MAY BE, UH, HOMESTEAD, HOMESTEAD RELIEF, OR, UH, THEIR ASSESSED VALUE OF THEIR HOME HAS NOT RISEN TO MARKET VALUE.
SO I THINK WE CAN ANTICIPATE, UM, A LARGER, UH, VALUE PER MILL IN THIS, UM, FOR THIS PART OF THE TAX REVENUE, UH, TANYA, ARE YOU PREPARED TO GIVE US A BRIEF UPDATE
[00:20:01]
ON EXPENDITURES? UM, WELL, I HAD PLANNED TO DO THAT, UH, OUR NEXT MEETING ON APRIL 20TH, UH, THE FULL BOARD MEETING, I PLAN TO PROVIDE AN EXPENDITURE UPDATE, UM, AT THAT MEETING, AS WELL AS, UM, INFORM THE BOARD OF THIS, UH, PROVIDE THIS PRESENTATION AS WELL.IT WILL BE VERY TIMELY BECAUSE OF THE CONVERSATION WITH THE STEP OF THE STEP INCREASE AND THE BONUSES.
SO I THINK THE FULL BOARD NEEDS THIS INFORMATION FIRST, AND THEN THEY WILL NEED INFORMATION ON THE EXPENDITURE SAVINGS, WHICH I'LL PROVIDE SPECIFIC CATEGORIES AT THAT TIME.
UH, WE DO EXPECT THERE TO BE SOME EXPENDITURE SAVINGS, UM, THIS YEAR AND IT, WE BELIEVE THAT IT WILL COVER THE COSTS OF THE BONUS AND THE STEP INCREASE FOR THE CURRENT YEAR.
AND SO WE BELIEVE THAT WE CAN MANAGE BETWEEN THE GOOD NEWS OF THE REVENUE AND THE SAVINGS ON THE EXPENDITURE SIDE.
WE BELIEVE THAT WE WILL BE ABLE TO COVER THOSE, THOSE COSTS IN FULL, UM, BUT I WILL PROVIDE MORE SPECIFICS AT THE, UM, APRIL 20TH BOARD MEETING AND WITH SOME SPECIFIC AREAS OF, UH, OF SAVINGS, ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS.
[*A portion of this item is unavailable* Discussion of Fiscal Autonomy]
ITEM ON THE AGENDA.UH, MS. CARTWRIGHT IS, UH, IS ON ZOOM.
IS THAT RIGHT? CAN EVERYBODY HEAR ME IF YOU CAN.
UM, MR. GUYER, MR. MR. BECK HAIL AGAIN, WHO IS AS TINY.
AND I HAVE SAID AN EXPERT IN THE LAW, HE IS AVAILABLE TO ALSO BE ON THE LINE WITH US.
AND SO I'M GOING TO CALL HIM RIGHT NOW IF THAT'S OKAY WITH THE COMMITTEE, GO AHEAD.
AND BECAUSE HE CAN SUPPLEMENT THE INFORMATION THAT I PROVIDED, I'M GOING TO CALL HIM RIGHT NOW, WHILE YOU'RE DOING THAT AS COMMITTEE COMMITTEE MEMBERS, UH, I'VE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO READ THROUGH THE DOCUMENT THAT, UH, WENDY PROVIDED.
AND MY SUSPICIONS WERE CONFIRMED ABOUT WHY A COUNTY COUNCIL SEEMS TO BELIEVE THAT THEY CAN APPROVE OUR BUDGET BECAUSE IN THE PAST THEY WERE AUTHORIZED TO APPROVE OUR BUDGET AND, UH, THEY NO LONGER HAVE THAT AUTHORITY AND THIS DOCUMENT, UH, STEP GO STEP BY STEP WHEN IT WAS LOST, WHY IT WAS LOST AND WHAT THE COUNTY COUNCIL CAN NOW DO IS ONLY CERTIFY OUR, OUR BUDGET.
THEY CANNOT APPROVE OUR BUDGET.
AND THAT'S BEEN A MISTAKEN BELIEF BY A NUMBER OF COUNTY COUNCIL MEMBERS THAT WHEN THEY VOTED ON OUR BUDGET, THEY ARE VOTING APPROVE IT.
AND THAT IS NOT, NOT THE CASE.
SO, UH, FISCAL AUTONOMY IS ALREADY, WE ALREADY HAVE IT.
MR. HA, UM, MEMBERS OF THE COMMITTEE, THIS IS ON THE LINE WITH US RIGHT NOW IS MR. WILLIAM KNOWN AS BIG HAIL AGAIN.
AND MR. HALE AGAIN IS A PARTNER IN, UH, HALLIGAN AND WILLIAMS. HE IS, UH, BEEN A LAWYER FOR HOW MANY YEARS NOW, BEC IT'S IS IT OVER 40? SO 40 YEARS, 40 YEARS EXPERIENCE.
AND HE'S ACTUALLY, AS TANYA SAID, AND I AGREE WITH HER, HE IS AN EXPERT IN FISCAL AUTONOMY.
AND THEN WHEN THIS CAME UP BEFORE WORK SESSION, LAST YEAR, WE HAD THAT MEMORANDUM CONCERNING FISCAL AUTONOMY, THE ACT, UH, THE ACTS OF THE STATUTES AT LARGE, AND THAT EXCELLENT REMARKS THAT YOU GAVE TO THE COUNTY BOARD OF EDUCATION ON FEBRUARY 26, 2004, YOU HAD DONE ALL THAT RESEARCH AND GREAT DEPTH.
AND THEN THE LAST ITEM THAT WE PROVIDED WAS FROM THE SOUTH CAROLINA SCHOOL BOARD ASSOCIATION, THEY HAD
[00:25:01]
A LIST OF FISCAL AUTHORITY FOR DISTRICTS, AND THEN THAT MEMORANDUM CONCERNING FISCAL AUTONOMY.SO, UM, I SAID, YOU KNOW, SO MUCH MORE ABOUT THIS THAN I DO.
AND I ALSO HAVE STATUTE SIX DASH ONE, THREE 20 UP.
I JUST WANTED YOU TO BE ABLE TO ANSWER MR. GUYERS AND THE OTHER, UM, BOARD MEMBERS QUESTIONS THAT THEY MAY HAVE AND HOW WE GO FORWARD.
AND JUST FOR YOUR INFORMATION, I BELIEVE YOU ARE ALREADY AWARE OF THIS, BUT, UM, THERE'S GOING TO BE A JOINT MEETING WITH, UH, MEMBERS OF THE BOARD AND WITH COUNTY COUNCIL.
AND WE'VE HAD A LOT OF PROBLEMS WITH OUR MILLAGE AND OUR BUDGET, AND LOTS OF THINGS HAVE HAPPENED OVER THE YEARS.
I NEEDED TO GET STRAIGHTENED OUT, SO WE COULD BE FINANCIALLY SOLVENT AND NOT BE IN THIS SITUATION.
SO ANYWAY, MR.
UM, MR. GUYER ASKED YOU IS IF YOU COULD PLEASE EXPLAIN THE HISTORY OF FISCAL AUTONOMY WITH BUFORD COUNTY AND THE BUFORD COUNTY BOARD OF EDUCATION.
SO YOU'VE BEEN AROUND FOR OVER 25, 30 YEARS.
UM, WE'VE BEEN, UH, WORKED IN DO FOR, UH, WITH THE SCHOOL DISTRICT OF MID 1990.
UM, WE CAN DO A ZOOM IF YOU WANT.
UM, THE, I SERVED NOW SEEMS ANCIENT HISTORY FROM 1986 TO 1994.
I WAS A MEMBER OF THE RICHLAND ONE SCHOOL BOARD.
I WAS ELECTED TWICE AND THEN RETIRED AND BECAME A SCHOOL OR YOU'RE AT THAT POINT, BUT RICHLAND COUNTY ORIGINAL, AND ONE THAT ALSO HAD TO GO TO COUNTY COUNCIL AND I'VE NEVER REALLY UNDERSTOOD THE SORT OF THE STATUTES AND THE CONSTITUTION AS I APPLY AS YOU KNOW, IMPLEMENTED IN RICHLAND COUNTY.
BUT ONCE I STARTED REPRESENTING SCHOOL DISTRICTS ACROSS THE STATE, I BECAME AWARE OF JUST HOW MESSED UP THE WHOLE SYSTEM IS.
UM, EVERY IN OUR STATE STATE CONSTITUTION DELEGATES TO THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, THE RESPONSIBILITY TO ESTABLISH, UH, PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
AND SO, UH, THAT THROUGHOUT HISTORY WAS DICTATED BY EACH COUNTY DELEGATION.
AND THAT WAY IT WAS, I MEAN, SCHOOL DISTRICTS, COUNTIES AND COUNTIES WERE BOTH DEPENDENT ON ANNUAL BILLS PASSED BY THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, JUST LIKE SHE WAS BIG TITLE, BUT USUALLY BY THE COUNTY SENATOR, IT WAS ONE SENATOR PER COUNTY.
AND HE REALLY CONTROLLED THE COUNTY GOVERNMENT AND THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS AND SEPARATE TAX RATES.
WELL, WHAT THEN WHAT HAPPENED? OR IN THE EARLY FIFTIES, WHEN JIMMY BARNES WAS GOVERNOR, THERE WERE NEARLY 2000 SCHOOL DISTRICTS IN SOUTH CAROLINA.
BASICALLY EVERY SCHOOL WAS ITS OWN DISTRICT.
YOU HAD COUNTY BOARDS AND THEN YOU HAD LOCAL BOARDS AND A LOT OF THOSE STATUTES WERE STILL THERE.
WELL, GOVERNOR BURNS IN ORDER TO MAINTAIN SEPARATE, BUT EQUAL SCHOOLS VERY QUICKLY RECOGNIZED THAT THE SCHOOLS FOR AFRICAN AMERICANS WERE PITIFUL AND NO WAY WAS THE SYSTEM PEOPLE.
AND THAT IF HE HAD ANY CHANCE TO MAINTAIN THE SEGREGATION, THE AFRICAN AMERICAN SCHOOLS HAD TO BE MADE EQUAL.
AND SO HE CONVINCED THE LEGISLATURE TO ADOPT THE VERY FIRST SALES TAX FOR SCHOOLS.
UM, THEN HE WENT ON A BIG BUILDING PROGRAM.
WE, HE COULDN'T REPLACE ALL THE ONE ROOM SCHOOLS, SO THE STATE LEGISLATURE CONSOLIDATED SCHOOL DISTRICTS, AND EVENTUALLY THEY CONSOLIDATE DOWN NEARLY 2000,
[00:30:01]
UH, AND THEN BUILT A LOT OF SCHOOLS.DIFFERENT COUNTY WAS DIVIDED AT THE TWO SCHOOL DISTRICTS, UH, NORTH PART AND ABOUT PARK.
THEN THEY GOT, I FORGOT EXACTLY WHEN THEY GOT MERGED INTO THE BUFORD COUNTY SYSTEM, BUT IT'S PART.
AND SO UNDER THE CONSTITUTION, UNDER THIS SYSTEM, EACH COUNTY DELEGATIONS STILL MAINTAINED CONTROL OF ITS SCHOOL BOARD THROUGH WHAT WE CALL LOCAL LEGISLATION.
IT IS ACTUALLY STATEWIDE VOTED ON BY THE LEGISLATURE AS A WHOLE.
AND IT GOVERNS THE, UM, GOVERNING STRUCTURE OF THE SCHOOL BOARD.
IT SAYS, HOW MANY BOARD MEMBERS YOU HAVE? THE DELEGATION SAYS, HOW MANY, YOU KNOW, HOW MANY SEATS YOU HAVE A PORTION? YOU, UM, THEY DECLARE HOW ONE OF YOUR TERMS ARE ALL THAT SORT OF STUFF.
BUT THEY ALSO DEFINE THE FINANCIAL AUTHORITY OF, OF THE SCHOOL BOARD AND ACROSS THE STATE, THERE ARE 80 SOME SCHOOL DISTRICTS, AND THEY'RE PROBABLY ABOUT 60 DIFFERENT LAWS THAT SET UP FINANCIAL AUTHORITY AND THEY'RE ALL WORDED THERE.
AND THERE HAVE BEEN CERTAIN DECISIONS BY THE SUPREME COURT THAT HAVE HAD AN EFFECT, UM, HOLD RULES FOR CITIES.
THE SYSTEM WAS BREAKING DOWN AS THE STATE GREW IN DURING THE AFTER WORLD WAR II DURING THE SIXTIES, ESPECIALLY.
AND SO EVENTUALLY THEY GOT AROUND PASSING IN 1977, THE LATE SEVENTIES, ITS SERIES OF CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS, WHICH GAVE CITIES AND COUNTIES FINANCIAL AUTHORITY.
THEY DIDN'T HAVE TO GO TO THE LEGISLATURE ANYMORE, BUT ESTABLISHED COUNTY COUNCILS THAT GAVE THEM FINANCIAL AUTHORITY.
SO COUNTIES NOW HAD ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES WHO COULD ESTABLISHED TAX RIGHTS, WHERE YOU STILL ARE APPOINTED SCHOOL BOARDS THAT WERE APPOINTED BY ALLOCATIONS.
YOU HAD A GREAT LITTLE WATKINS TO GIVE SCHOOL BOARDS AUTHORITY.
THERE WAS NO HOME RULE PASSED FOR SCHOOL BOARDS.
SO WHILE CITIES AND COUNTIES HAD FINANCIAL SCHOOL BOARDS ARE STILL DEPENDENT ON UNIQUE LEGISLATION THAT JUST APPLIES TO THEIR COUNTY OR THEIR SCHOOL DISTRICT LAW IS VERY OLD AND IT WAS, I CAN'T REMEMBER RIGHT NOW, I'M NOT LOOKING AT ANYTHING THAT WOULD ADD ANYTHING.
UM, BUT THE, IT PREDATES, UH, THE, UM, ALL THE HOME STUFF IS BACK IN THE SIXTIES.
MAYBE EVEN THE FIFTIES AND IT'S, IT'S WORDED VERY PROCURE.
IT HAS VERY PECULIAR LANGUAGE THAT STILL HAS.
THE DELEGATION WAS IN THERE FOR GETTING INFORMATION.
UH, THE COUNTY COUNCIL HAD JUST BEEN ESTABLISHED BY STATUTE.
UM, AND SO IT'S A VERY WEIRD STATUTE.
AND THOSE OLDER LADDERS, WE WERE TRYING TO FIGURE THIS ALL OUT, BACK IN THE LATE NINETIES, EARLY TWO THOUSANDS, WHEN THE CONFLICT WAS, IT WAS AS INTENSE AS THE CONFLICT WAS AS INTENSE AS ANY PLACE IN THE STATE WHERE THE SCHOOL BOARD AND THE COUNTY COUNCIL WERE JUST AT LOGGERHEADS.
THEN WHAT YOU HAVE KIND OF HAPPENING AT THE SAME TIME IS THE TREMENDOUS GROWTH OF THE TAX BASE OF DEFER COUNTY, WHERE EACH PROPERTY JUST SKYROCKETED AND YOU'D HAVE HOTELS, SHOPPING CENTERS AND ALL THE STUFF THAT'S HAPPENED IN BUFORD COUNTY, WHICH QUICKLY WHICH MADE DO FOR, FROM A PROPERTY TAX STANDPOINT FOR SCHOOLS, MAYBE THE WEALTHIEST COUNTY IN THE STATE, IF NOT MAYBE SECOND TO CHARLESTON, I MEAN, YOU'RE THE RIGHT THERE AT THE TIME.
SO THAT YOU'VE BEEN IN, YOU KNOW, THE WEALTH FORMULA THEN PURDUE FOR VERY WEALTHY, VERY DEPENDENT ON LOCAL TAXES, PROPERTY TAXES FOR YOUR BUDGET AS THE STATE WITHDREW RESOURCES, YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO BE ABLE TO REPLACE THEM LOCALLY.
IT ENDS UP IN MORE DEPENDENT THAN EVER BEFORE ON LOCAL PROPERTY TAXES, THE PROPERTY TAX RATE,
[00:35:02]
YOUR ASSESSED VALUES ARE VERY HIGH, ESPECIALLY PER PUPIL.AND SO, UM, THAT SETS THE STAGE FOR CONFLICT.
NOW, THE, UM, YOU KNOW, WE WERE IN LETTERS, UM, THROUGH THE CATERS TO THE CHAIRMAN OF THE COUNTY COUNCIL, TO THE DELEGATION AND ALL THAT SORT OF STUFF, BUT WHERE DO YOU ARE RIGHT NOW? IT IS STILL VERY MUCH IN THE POWER OF THE DELEGATION, WHETHER TO CHANGE THE WALL AND GIVE, UM, AND I DON'T, LIKE YOU SAY, THERE'S NO SUCH THING ANYMORE AS AN OLD LIMITED FISCAL AUTHORITY, EVERY SCHOOL BOARD, EVERY COUNTY, AND EVERY CITY IS SUBJECT TO THAT SAME LATE LIMITATION.
UM, AS PART OF THAT CREATE THAT, YOU KNOW, GAVE AN EXEMPTION FOR THE HOMESTEAD.
IT A LOT OF THINGS, BUT ONE OF THE THINGS IT DID IS PUT IN A REALLY HARD BASED ON POPULATION AND CONCERN ABOUT THE CPI, UM, FOR A RATE INCREASE.
NOW IT'S INTERESTING THAT THAT RATE INCREASE IS JUST FROM YEAR TO YEAR.
THERE'S NO ABSOLUTE, IT COULD GO UP A LITTLE BIT ALL THE TIME.
AND IT ACTUALLY, UH, IS VERY DEFINITIVE FOR BUFORD BECAUSE YOUR RATE IS SO LOW, THEREFORE, YOU KNOW, A 1% CAP FOR YOU IS A MILL OR A MILL AND A HALF OR SOMETHING.
WHEREAS IF A DISTRICT HAS A 300 MILL FOR SCHOOLS, 1% IS WHAT, UM, OR THREE MILLS.
I MEAN, I'M COMPETING IN MY HEAD, BUT IT'S THE HIGHER YOUR RATE, THE HIGHER YOUR ANNUAL LIMIT.
SO IT'S AN ACCELERATING THING, BUT THE, UH, THE BASE LAW THAT YOU DON'T HAVE IS TALKS IN TERMS OF THE BOARDS DEFINED THE RIGHT TO THE COUNTY COUNCIL.
WELL, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THE COUNTY COUNCIL HAS INTERPRETED THAT TO ME, THAT IT APPROVES YOUR ENTIRE BUDGET, WHICH IS NONSENSE BECAUSE YOU STILL GET A TON OF MONEY FROM THE STATE, VARIOUS CATEGORIES OF DATA, CATEGORICAL MONEY, CERTAIN WAYS THE COUNTY COUNCIL CAN TELL YOU TO SPEND STATE OR FEDERAL MONEY IN SOME WAY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT THE STATE AND THE FEDERAL ARE TELLING YOU TO DO WITH IT.
SO THEY ACT LIKE THEY CONTROL ALL OF YOUR BUDGETS.
AND IN FACT, THEY CONTROL A SUBSTANTIAL CHUNK, BUT IT'S, IT'S, IT'S THE LOCAL PROPERTY TAX RATE THAT IS ALL THAT THEY POSSIBLY CAN HAVE ANY EFFECT, BUT THERE THERE'S, THERE ALL KINDS OF CONTROLS ON TRANSFERRING MONEY BETWEEN FUNDS, UH, RESTRICTED, THE SUPERINTENDENTS, AUTHORITY, AUTHORITY CONTROL THE SUPERINTENDENTS.
I MEAN, IT WAS LIKE HORRIBLE OVERREACH AND, AND THE BOARD AUTHORIZED US AND WE WROTE A BUNCH OF LETTERS AND WE COMPLAINED, COMPLAINED, COMPLAINED BECAUSE IT'S OVERREACHING.
AND THEN WE WERE GOING TO IGNORE THEM ON EVERYTHING, BUT THE RIGHT PRETTY MUCH THAT'S WHAT EVERYBODY DID.
THEN THEY BACKED UP THERE FOR A WHILE ON THE ORDINANCE AND KIND OF REMOVED THAT FULL CONTROL OF THE, OF THE REVENUE AND EXPENSE BUDGET.
I MEAN, YOU HAVE TO THINK OF IT AS BOTH SIDES OF IT, BUT THE LANGUAGE OF THE STATUTE HAS NEVER CHANGED.
NOW, THE BOARD HAS WALKED UP RIGHT TO THE EDGE OF SUING THE COUNTY, PROBABLY FIVE OR SIX TIMES, NOT RECENTLY.
AND A LOT OF TIMES IT DEPENDS ON THE RELATIVE POLITICAL STRENGTH AT THE TIME.
I MEAN, THE BOARD HAS GONE THROUGH SOME HARD TIMES WITH A LOT OF EVENTS THAT WERE HARD POLITICALLY FOR THE SCHOOL BOARD.
I THINK THE COUNTY HAS GONE THROUGH SOME OF THE SAME THINGS.
UM, AND, BUT THE DELEGATION WAS JUST SORT OF SAT THERE AND THEY HAVE TYPICALLY SAID LES NEWTON WAS THE CHAIR OF THE COUNTY COUNCIL.
SENATOR DAVIS HAS BEEN THERE A LONG TIME NOW.
UM, THEY WERE, THEY WERE NEVER IN FAVOR OF FISCAL AUTONOMY, UM, WESTERNERS AND ESPECIALLY WAS VERY STRONG THAT THE BOARD NEEDED SUPERVISION BY BASICALLY.
[00:40:01]
TODAY, THE ONE OF THE MAIN REASONS THE SCHOOL BOARD NEVER BOUGHT THE CASE IS WON A POLITICAL LAWSUIT.LIKE THIS IS VERY HARD ON EVERYBODY TENDENCIES THE PUBLICATION.
SHE SPENT A FEW YEARS ON LAWYERS.
THE LOCAL JUDGES ARE PROBABLY NOT GOING TO OVAL THE PAST PRACTICE.
SO YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO GO TO THE SUPREME COURT.
SO THERE'S DELAY THERE'S EXPENSE THAT YOU GET CRITICIZED FOR AND THE DELEGATION IN ANY MEDIC AND RIGHT, YOU KNOW, WHITE, A NEW LAW, THAT SAME CHALLENGE, YOU KNOW, IT WAS VERY HARD TO CHALLENGE IT.
SO THE, IT HAS BEEN OUR RECOMMENDATION TO, YOU KNOW, DRAFT UP IF THE DELEGATION IS PREPARED TO CHANGE THE LAW, IF IT IS THEN THAT'S EASY WAY, UH, NOT EASY WAY, BUT THAT'S THE MOST STRAIGHTFORWARD WAY.
THE OTHER WAY IS TO GET THE COUNTY COUNCIL POLITICALLY TO RECOGNIZE THE LIMIT ON ITS POWERS THE MOST AS IS THE RIGHT TO SET A RIGHT.
IT IS SUBJECT TO THE SAME LIMIT, WHETHER THE COUNTY COUNCIL SETS THE SCHOOL, RIGHT, OR WHETHER THE SCHOOL BOARD SETS THE SCHOOL, RIGHT.
YOU'RE SUBJECT TO THE SAME ONE THAT, AND THAT THEY HAVE NO AUTHORITY WHATSOEVER OVER THE INTERIOR PARTS OF HOW YOU ALLOCATE THE MONEY AND WHAT YOU DO.
BUT THAT'S SUBJECT OF STATE LAWS ARE SUBJECT TO FEDERAL LAW AS THE SUBJECT OF THE BOARD'S PRIORITIES, BUT THEY DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO SAY ABOUT IT, BUT THAT IS JUST A FEMORAL RESTRICTION.
UM, WE'VE TRIED TO, WE'D HAVE DRAFTED FOR ANOTHER COUNTY, UM, A SORT OF ATTEMPT OF NOT, NOT A TEMPLATE BECAUSE IT'S DRAFTED JUST FOR THAT COUNTY WHERE THE COUNTY COUNCIL WOULD RESTRICT ITSELF BY ORDINANCE AS TO ITS PROCEDURE AND WHAT IT WOULD DO.
AND BASICALLY IT SAYS, WE'RE GOING TO ACCEPT WHAT THE SCHOOL BOARD SAYS, IT'S THEIR BUSINESS, THEY'RE ELECTED.
THEY GET TO CONTROL THIS THING.
THEY HAVE A LIMITED RATE AS DO WE, YOU KNOW, THAT SORT OF RESPONSIBILITY.
AND THE COUNTY COUNCIL SAYS THAT FORMALLY IN AN ORDINANCE.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, THAT GIVES YOU AUTHORITY.
SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE BIG BACKGROUND TO THIS, UM, YOU ALL, OR IF YOU'RE FRUSTRATED NOW WITH THE COUNTY, YOU'RE RIGHT IN LINE WITH THE SCHOOL BOARDS OF DIFFERENT COUNTY FOR THE LAST 25 YEARS, FOR THE MOST PART THAT DRAWN ON THAT'S EXCELLENT.
I'D LIKE TO ADD SOME THINGS TO THAT.
UM, PAPERWORK WE'VE GOTTEN TALKS ABOUT, UH, THE LEGISLATION WAS ADOPTED IN 1968, SLIGHTLY REVISED IN 1969.
NOW THAT DATE ISN'T JUST, UM, BY HAPPENSTANCE, THAT ALSO IS CONCURRENT WITH DESEGREGATION AND THAT'S PART OF THE MULTIPLE SCHOOL DISTRICTS IN BUFORD COUNTY.
AND SO IF YOU REALLY WANT TO LOOK AT THIS AND NOT SUGARCOAT IT, THIS WAS JIM CROW.
THIS WAS KEEPING TRACK OF, WE CAN'T TRUST THE SCHOOL BOARD.
WE CAN'T TRUST AN INTEGRATED SCHOOL DISTRICT.
NOW, WHEN YOU LOOK AT ALL THE CASE LAW, AND YOU LOOK AT THE HOME RULE PROCESS, AND YOU LOOK AT, WHAT'S BEEN TALKED ABOUT AND LITIGATED IN COURT THROUGHOUT THE STATE, IT'S VERY, VERY CLEAR THAT THE HOME RULE LAW, THE STATE LAW, THE STATE INTENT IS THAT SCHOOL DISTRICTS MANAGE THEIR BUDGET, NOT UNDER THE CONTROL OF COUNTY COUNCILS PERIOD.
SO BASICALLY WHAT THIS COMES DOWN TO IS WE HAVE FISCAL AUTONOMY, AUTONOMY, BUT WE HAVE OUTDATED COUNTY COUNCIL ORDINANCE THAT PROHIBIT THAT.
SO THERE'S AN EASY WAY TO FIX THIS, AND THERE'S A HARD WAY TO FIX THIS.
AND I'M HOPING BY MEETING WITH THE COUNTY COUNCIL LEADERSHIP, WE CAN CONVINCE THEM THAT LET'S DO THE EASY WAY.
[00:45:01]
AND THE EASY WAY IS FOR YOU TO ADJUST YOUR COUNTY COUNCIL ORDINANCE, TO SAY THAT YOU HAVE THE AUTHORITY AS A COUNTY COUNCIL TO CERTIFY THE BUFORD COUNTY SCHOOL DISTRICTS BUDGET AND CERTIFY MEANS YES, THE SCHOOL DISTRICT COUNTY OR SCHOOL BOARD MET IN MEETINGS.ALL THE MEMBERS WERE THERE SHOULD HAVE BEEN.
THERE WEREN'T ANY, UH, UH, GHOST MEMBERS THAT WERE, THAT WERE MAKING DECISIONS.
AND THIS IS WHAT THE PUBLICLY ELECTED SCHOOL DISTRICT SAYS IS THEN AMOUNT OF MONEY.
THEY NEED TO EDUCATE OUR CHILDREN AND CERTIFIED FINE LOOKING AT IT, MAKE COMMENTS, BUT WE DO NOT NEED A MAJORITY OF THE COUNTY COUNCIL TO APPROVE OUR BUDGET.
THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN, UH, OR DO YOU WANT TO DO UNDER THE STATUTES? RIGHT.
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THAT, BUT FOR A LONG TIME, THAT HAS NOT BEEN THE PRACTICE BEFORE ACTING AS IF THE COUNTY DID APPROVE IT.
AND I JUST, YOU KNOW, THE LANGUAGE IS REALLY TERRIBLE.
I MEAN, THERE'S NO QUESTION, NO QUESTION ABOUT THAT, BUT IT'S BEEN ONE OF THOSE FACTORS THAT IS ALONG WITH ALL THE OTHERS, YOU KNOW, UM, AND I NEVER DISCOUNT THE POWER OF AN ELECTED OFFICIAL.
I THINK THEY LIKE WHEN SOMEBODY IS ELECTED, THEY LIKED THE CONTROL AND THE COUNTY COUNCIL LIKES TO CONTROL STUFF THAT THEY THINK THEY MIGHT DELEGATION LOVES TO CONTROL OTHER ENTITIES.
THEY THINK LATE ON THE SHOW SORT OF DO.
BUT, UM, UH, I THINK YOU'RE EXACTLY CORRECT.
I MEAN, THE EASY WAY IS TO GET THE COUNTY COUNCIL TO RECOGNIZE THAT ITS POWERS, UM, YEAH.
I THINK QUESTION IS THEN I KNOW WE'RE, WE'RE BATTING AROUND THE TERMINOLOGY CERTIFIED OR APPROVED.
I MEAN, IF THEY'RE GOING TO CERTIFY SOMETHING, MY ASSUMPTION IS, IS THAT THEY HAVE TO TAKE A BOAT.
UM, IS THAT ACCURATE? SO, I MEAN, I KNOW IT'S, WE'RE SAYING IT'S CERTIFIED, BUT THEY HAVE TO TAKE A VOTE, WHICH WOULD REQUIRE A MAJORITY OF THEM TO VOTE FOR CERTIFICATION.
IS THAT AN ACCURATE ASSESSMENT? I MEAN, SO IT MIGHT JUST BE NOT NECESSARILY THEM APPROVING, BUT CERTIFICATION ALSO STILL REQUIRES A MAJORITY VOTE.
AND SO WHAT HAPPENS THEN? UM, IF THE MAJORITY DOES NOT VOTE TO CERTIFY, WHAT IS, WHAT IS THE OUTCOME OF A NON-CERTIFIED, UM, BUDGET? WELL, THE COUNTY AUDITOR THEN WANT TO ASK PROBABLY THE COUNTY ATTORNEY FOR ADVICE.
DOES THIS MEAN THAT I SET THE RATE SET BY THE SCHOOL BOARD? OR DO I SET THE RATE OR END OF THE TAX NOTICE OR SOMETHING ELSE? BECAUSE AT THAT POINT, THIS, IF THE SCHOOL BOARD IS SET, ONE WAY COUNTY ASSEMBLY SAYS WE DON'T CERTIFY, WELL, THE COUNTY OFFICES, I DON'T KNOW WHAT RATE TO PUT IN THE TAX COUNTY ATTORNEY THEN EXPRESSES, WHO KNOWS WHAT OPINION YOU'RE IN THE POSITION THAT IF HE WANTS THAT THE RIGHT THEN YOU HAVE TO BRING WHAT WE WOULD CALL A WRIT OF MANDAMUS THAT IS YOU'RE ASKING THE COURT TO TELL THE, TO SET THE RATE THAT YOU SET THAT KICKS OFF THE LAWSUIT.
I MEAN, THAT'S THE WAY A LAWSUIT WOULD HAVE BEGAN, OR YOU COULD, YOU KNOW, YOU PATCH YOUR BUDGET, YOU PASS ALL YOUR BUDGET, BUT YOUR TAX RATE, AND THEN YOU BRING A LAWSUIT SAYING THE COUNTY'S BOUND BY THIS, THE AUDITOR'S BOUND BY THIS.
YOU SEE THE WORD CERTIFICATION IS REALLY BEAUTIFUL.
I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY OTHER SCHOOL BOARD THAT HAS THAT IN THEIR BASE BASEBALL.
USUALLY IT'S APPROVED A RATE, APPROVE A BUDGET.
UM, BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT BUFORD AND THAT'S, THAT'S MY MEMORY.
[00:50:01]
THE LETTERS WE WROTE OR THE BACKUP MATERIALS FROM THE WALLS AND SO ON.BUT MY MEMORY IS, IS THAT THOSE TWO THINGS IN 68, 69, 68, YOU KNOW, THAT IS A PRE HOME RULE.
PRE-FILLING FULL FORMAL PRE UH, HOME RULE WALL.
UH, THAT IS THAT IT'S PRE EVERYTHING PRE UH, YEAH, 1977 IS BEFORE HOME RULE IN 1975 TO 77.
IT'S RE IT'S ACTUALLY BEFORE INTEGRATION.
I MEAN THE REALLY FORCED INTEGRATION.
UM, FOR THE AI, ALL RIGHT, LEMME WERE ADOPTED.
I MEAN, IT IS LIKE ANCIENT HISTORY.
I MEAN, IT IS, UM, YEAH, PRE PREVIOUS PRE POST.
I MEAN, IT'S JUST, IT'S ABSURD THAT THAT'S, UM, BUT YEAH, NOBODY KNOWS WHAT THAT WORD CERTIFIED MEANS.
IT DOESN'T, IT DOESN'T, THEY APPROVE.
I MEAN, SO, YOU KNOW, SORT OF, I'M JUST, IT COULD BE GIVEN A MEANING OF, OF, UH, NO IMPORTANCE OR GREAT IMPORTANCE.
UM, THAT'S WHY I THINK IT'S BEEN OUR EXPERIENCE.
WE'D HAVE IT LAWSUITS FOR FISCAL AUTONOMY IN JASPER COUNTY AND ANDERSON, WE'VE LOOKED CAREFULLY AT IT, RICH ONES, CRUCIAL DORCHESTER, UM, THAT, UM, THE LOWER COURT I USE A TRIAL JUDGE HATES THIS KIND OF CASE.
AND HE'S GOING TO, THERE WILL HAVE BEEN TELEPHONE CALLS TO THE DELEGATION.
WHAT DO YOU WANT ME TO THE ALLEGATIONS? I KNOW I JUST LIKED YOUR SELECTS.
THE JUDGES SAID THIS WAS A HIGHLY POLITICAL CASE, AND THEY'RE GOING TO PAY ATTENTION OF WHAT THE DELEGATION WANTS THEM TO DO.
AND, UM, THAT'S WHY THIS, THESE ARE POLITICAL CASES.
THEY DON'T TURN NECESSARILY, THEY CAN TURN ON THE LANGUAGE OF A WALL, BUT USUALLY IT'S A POLITICAL DECISION.
I'LL TELL YOU A STORY ABOUT, WE HAD A STATUTE THAT WAS IN THE LATE 1990S, THEIR STATUTES, THE ONE THING THE SUPREME COURT HAS SAID IS THE LOCAL DELEGATION SITTING BY IT AND NOT SET A TAX RATE IS NOT AN ELECTED BODY.
THAT'S AN OLDEST DIVISION PROBABLY.
I MEAN, UH, UM, I MEAN THAT IS 50, 60, 70 YEARS OLD.
UM, BUT THE OREGON STATUTES THAT THE SCHOOL BOARD WOULD ADOPT, YOU KNOW, PROPOSALS, RIGHT.
THEY WOULD SEND TO THE DELEGATION, THE DELEGATION WOULD SEND THE WHITE, I MEAN, CLEARLY UNCONSTITUTIONAL.
NOW THEY DIDN'T INVOLVE WITH COUNTY COUNCIL BECAUSE IT JUST WENT STRAIGHT TO THE DELEGATION.
WELL, WE TALKED TO THE DELEGATION AND THEY SAID, YEAH, WE KNOW THAT, BUT WE DON'T WANT TO PASS ANOTHER BILL.
AND SO WE BOUGHT A LAWSUIT AGAINST THE DELEGATION IN A CIRCUIT COURT JUDGE LOCKING ME.
I MEAN, I SHOULDN'T HAVE SAID HIS NAME, BUT WHEN HE WAS MEETING WITH US WAS VERY, VERY WORRIED ABOUT WHAT THE DELEGATION THOUGHT ABOUT IT.
AND WE SAID, LOOK, WE'VE CLEARED THIS WITH A DELEGATION, BUT HE'S THE ONLY PASS ANOTHER WALL, BUT IT'S UNCONSTITUTIONAL.
AND SO IT OUGHT TO BE JUST THE SCHOOL BOARDS.
THERE'S NO REFERENCE TO COUNTY COUNCIL AND THIS LOBEL WALL, IT GOES TO THE DELEGATION.
THAT'S OUR SCHOOL BOARD LIKE THE BODY DETERMINANT.
AND I'M SURE HE PHONE CALLS BECAUSE HE WILL, YOU KNOW, HE SIGNED OUR ORDER JUST STRAIGHT UP ALL THAT'S HOW OR EAT TODAY.
THAT'S THE SCORES, THE ARTISTS IT'S THAT ORDER FROM THE LATE NINETIES, BUT DELEGATIONS NEVER WANTED TO TOUCH IT.
DON'T IN THE SAME POSITION, DELEGATION.
I MEAN, THEY COULD HAVE DONE SOMETHING LONG AGO, BUT I WAS LOSING THAN THE OTHER PEOPLE, THE WAR ON THE COUNTY COUNCIL AND HER NOW ENDED DELEGATION OR PLACE SMART.
THEY KNOW HOW WEIRD THAT LANGUAGE IS.
THEY JUST DON'T WANT TO TOUCH IT.
SO, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, I, I THINK THE IDEA OF GETTING THE COUNTY COUNCIL ON MAJORITY OF COUNTY COUNCIL TO SIMPLY BACK OFF, RIGHT.
[00:55:01]
YES, THAT IS BY FAR THE SIMPLEST WAY.IT'S NOT PROMINENT BECAUSE LIKE, YOU KNOW, A MAJORITY CAN CHANGE THEIR MIND NEXT YEAR, BUT IT'S THE WAY TO HANDLE IT QUICKLY.
AND, YOU KNOW, IT BECOMES HARD FOR THEM TO BACK OFF OF THAT IN THE FUTURE.
AND ONCE THEY ADOPT THAT POSITION, YOU KNOW, THAT THEN BECOMES THE NEW NORM AND BECOMES MORE DIFFICULT.
UM, SO ANYWAY, MR. CAMPBELL, HI, I AGREE WITH ANYTHING Y'ALL SAID, BUT THEY ARE, YOU WILL NEVER GET A UNANIMOUS VOTE ON COUNTY COUNCIL.
YOU WILL NOT GET AN ANONYMOUS VOTE WITH THE DELEGATION BECAUSE SEVEN FOLKS IN DELEGATION HAVE ALREADY SAID TIME AND TIME AGAIN, THAT THEY WILL NOT GIVE PHYSICAL TIME AT SCHOOL WITH HISTORY.
YOU KNOW, AND I, I AGREE WITH WHAT ALL THEY'VE SAID, AND MAYBE IN THE END, I JUST KNOW I MIGHT NOT BE HERE.
AND THEN, BUT IN THE END YOU GOT TO PROP AFFLECK, TAKE, TAKE THEM TO COURT BECAUSE EVERYBODY'S ELECTED, YOU'RE ELECTED BY THE SAME FOLKS THAT THEY'RE ALL LIKE DUBAI, YOU KNOW, SO THEY CAN'T KEEP SAYING THIS EXCUSES, YOU KNOW, THEY, AT FIRST THEY SAID THAT THEY DIDN'T TRUST HIM AND DATA.
TRUESDALE LEFT, HE DIDN'T TRUST, UM, DR.
MOSS, YOU KNOW, AND IT'S, IT'S, THESE, THESE FOLKS ARE OBSESSED WITH POWER.
AND IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT IS GOING ON IN THIS COUNTRY TODAY, THAT'S WHAT IT IS.
IT IT'S NOT BECAUSE ANYTHING IS WRONG, BUT THEY ARE OBSESSIVE POWER.
THEY DON'T WANT TO TURN THAT POWER, YOU KNOW, AND THEN THAT'S, THAT'S MY THING.
AND WITH ALL DUE RESPECT TO MR. CAMPBELL, I WOULDN'T, UM, EVER SIT HERE AND DEMONIZE SOMEBODY AND SAY THAT THEY'RE OBSESSED WITH POWER.
I THINK THAT'S, UH, A LITTLE BIT OF A, UM, INAPPROPRIATE COMMENT, BUT, UM, I THINK THAT TIMES CONTINUE TO CHANGE AND OBVIOUSLY COUNTY COUNCIL MAKEUP AND BOARD SCHOOL, BOARD MAKEUP CHANGES AS WELL.
UM, SO IN THAT REGARD, YOU KNOW, THE OPINIONS OF THE DELEGATION COULD HAVE ALSO CHANGED AND CONVERSATIONS SHOULD BE HAD IN THE CURRENT BASED ON THE CURRENT STATE OF AFFAIRS.
UM, AND LOOKING INTO THE PAST, OBVIOUSLY AS A LEARNING OPPORTUNITY, UM, FOR HOW WE CAN NAVIGATE THAT CONVERSATION FOR THE FUTURE.
UM, I THINK THAT BEYOND JUST TALKING TO COUNTY COUNCIL, I THINK THIS ALSO SHOULD BE A CONVERSATION THAT WE'RE HAVING WITH OUR LEGISLATIVE DELEGATION.
AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT I WOULD ENCOURAGE THE FINANCE COMMITTEE TO PROPOSE TO THE FULL BOARD, UM, AS THAT IS A LOGICAL STEP IN THIS WHOLE PROCESS, UM, TO TRY TO AVOID LITIGATION BECAUSE THAT'S COSTLY AND, YOU KNOW, THAT PULLS FROM OUR BUDGET AS WELL AS THEIRS.
AND I DON'T THINK THEY WANT TO ENGAGE IN THAT EITHER.
SO I THINK IF WE TAKE THE DIPLOMATIC ROUTE AND TRYING TO HAVE CONVERSATIONS, UM, AND ENGAGE IN THEM IN A, UH, MORE POSITIVE MANNER, PERHAPS, AND, AND USE SOME LESS INFLAMMATORY LANGUAGE, IT MIGHT GET US A LOT FARTHER.
MY MOM SAID, YOU ALWAYS, YOU KNOW, YOU CATCH MORE FLIES WITH HONEY.
SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE US TO TRY TO USE THAT TONE AND TENOR AND A FEATURE OF OUR CONVERSATIONS.
UM, BUT I DO THINK THE HISTORY AND THE PAST TEACHES US A LOT OF THINGS.
THAT'S ALL I HAVE TO SAY ON THAT.
MY COMMENTS, THIS HAS BEEN UP AND DOWN IN THE PAST AND IT GETS DRUNK AND IT NEVER GETS RESOLVED.
I AM NOT, AS LONG AS I'M ON THE SCHOOL BOARD, I AM NOT GOING TO LET THIS DROP.
WHEN I LOOK AT THE LAW IT'S BEEN, AND I'M NOT AN ATTORNEY, BUT IT IS VERY, VERY CLEAR IF IT GOES TO COURT AT.